All Topics / Finance / The True Power of an Offset Account
Hello All
Although I always understood how an offset account worked, it wasn’t until I started playing with a few numbers with the below calculator that I realised the true power of an offset account…
http://info.westpac.com.au/homeloans/calculatortools/offset-calculator/
Eg. A $300,000 loan over 30 years at 5.98% paid fortnightly with an avetage of $10,000 in the offset account for the life of the loan will reduce the total interest payable by $45,575 !
If you get a few minutes, why not have a play yourself ?
The power of compounding.
Imagine if you could save an extra 0.1% off the loan and structure things so you can get an extra $5k pa in tax deductions and use the offset account.
I see so many people who are costing themselves a fortune because of poor structuring.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Brilliant link – thanks for sharing!
Yep, offsets are a thing of beauty (wow – how nerdy of me).
For those disciplined with money, it can be handy using the offset as a transaction and savings account. You have all your income going into the account – including salaries and IP rent. Every dollar helps – even if parked in the account for a short period.
Cheers
Jamie
Jamie Moore | Pass Go Home Loans Pty Ltd
http://www.passgo.com.au
Email Me | Phone MeMortgage Broker assisting clients Australia wide Email: [email protected]
Yes great link, thanks.
It's good to see when it all starts coming together (offsets, structuring)
ChrisA1
Persistence is 'to keep on keeping on, no matter how hard the going may be'
Terryw wrote:I see so many people who are costing themselves a fortune because of poor structuring.
Hi Terrw,
Are you able to advise what is the best way to structure accounts for people where you have a basic portfolio such as the follows and looking to be able to most effectively scale up and grow the number of investment properties whilst still making sure we are maximizing all tax benefits, lowest costs and having the flexibillty.
- 1 x PPOR
- 2 x Investment Property
I'd be interested to hear what combinations of Home PPOR Loan vs Investment Property Loan, Offset Accounts for each or Line of Credit account structure people should be creating. Moreover would be curious to understand how best to operate these. For Example like: place all salary in account 'X', all rental income in account 'Y', all renovation/bills/deposits for new IP from account 'Z'
jate wrote:Terryw wrote:I see so many people who are costing themselves a fortune because of poor structuring.
Hi Terrw,
Are you able to advise what is the best way to structure accounts for people where you have a basic portfolio such as the follows and looking to be able to most effectively scale up and grow the number of investment properties whilst still making sure we are maximizing all tax benefits, lowest costs and having the flexibillty.
- 1 x PPOR
- 2 x Investment Property
There's no one size fits all but a good general structure is interest only for all loans with an offset linked to the PPOR. I'd have all rents and other income paid into the offset and use a credit card with a points system for everyday expenses. I'd then clear the credit card once a month before interest kicks in.
This article I wrote for Australian Property Investor magazine explains the concept in a little more detail.
Cheers
Jamie
Jamie Moore | Pass Go Home Loans Pty Ltd
http://www.passgo.com.au
Email Me | Phone MeMortgage Broker assisting clients Australia wide Email: [email protected]
Offset could be my partner <3 i do the same as Jamie all rent/salary goes in and just use a credit card and repay before the interest kicks in
Tony Fleming | Triumphant Property Group
http://www.triumphantpropertygroup.com.au
Email MeNSW Buyer's Agent specialising in Western Sydney-Blue Mountains-Orange-Albury
jate wrote:Terryw wrote:I see so many people who are costing themselves a fortune because of poor structuring.
Hi Terrw,
Are you able to advise what is the best way to structure accounts for people where you have a basic portfolio such as the follows and looking to be able to most effectively scale up and grow the number of investment properties whilst still making sure we are maximizing all tax benefits, lowest costs and having the flexibillty.
- 1 x PPOR
- 2 x Investment Property
I'd be interested to hear what combinations of Home PPOR Loan vs Investment Property Loan, Offset Accounts for each or Line of Credit account structure people should be creating. Moreover would be curious to understand how best to operate these. For Example like: place all salary in account 'X', all rental income in account 'Y', all renovation/bills/deposits for new IP from account 'Z'
It all depends on many things such as if properties owned jointly or solely etc
generally
PPOR
IO loan with 100% offset
All income and rent to go into the offsetEquity in the PPOR should be accessed via a LOC. Best not to use a standard loan as deductibility can be destroyed – and I am licenced to give tax advice so I can advise on this = in writing too
IP loan should be IO.
As IP grows equity should be accessed and ‘paid’ back to the LOC for a few reasons. 1 is to keep things separate a bit.
LOC can also be used to pay all expenses for the IP and this will free up cash to pay into the PPOR offset.
In some situations I may recommend paying off the PPOR. Depends on the circumstances – eg. large sum of cash in offset but no equity. Best not to use the cash to offset but to repay loan and borrow it.
Also use private spousal loans in some instances to maintain 104% deductibility when there is not enough equity.
I should add all loans are stand alone with no crossing of securities.
Existing properties should also be stand alone. If they are crossed you should uncross asap
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
The Dark Knight wrote:Offset could be my partner <3 i do the same as Jamie all rent/salary goes in and just use a credit card and repay before the interest kicks inClean, simple and effective and fingers and toes crossed the banks dont meddle with offsets down the track.
Colin Rice | CDR Finance
http://cdrfinance.com.au/
Email Me | Phone MePerth Based Mortgage Broker - Investment Property Finance Specialist | E: [email protected]
Matt_Arnold wrote:Eg. A $300,000 loan over 30 years at 5.98% paid fortnightly with an avetage of $10,000 in the offset account for the life of the loan will reduce the total interest payable by $45,575 !Jeez I hate these BS examples. The true power of Offset accounts are not in the piddley amounts of small change you might save over a time period but the ability to keep capital unencumbered so it can be deployed quickly with sensible amounts of leverage to generate a return.
The above example is nominal not real because it fails to include the lost tax deductability which in effect reduces the end result considerably. Scale for inflation and the savings wouldn’t buy a coffee once a week.
People also need to realise that banks offer products usually in conjunction with other products. Mortgages that allow offset accounts can incurr higher rates, fees and other charges which can further erode the nominal offset rates.
I agree Freckle, except perhaps for the fact that the offset account should be applied to private debt if it exists. There won't be any tax effect in this case. I doubt that you'd keep the private debt for thirty years if you could help it, but that's not really the issue.
My pet hate is when banks and advisers love to tell us how much interest we'll save if we pay just a little bit extra each month or pay 10k up front (which does the same as the 10k in the offset acct) without taking inflation into account as you've mentioned. The 10k or early repayments are in today's dollars, but they are saving dollars up to 30 years into the future. Let's try 2.5% average inflation for 30 years: that makes a dollar then worth about 47c now. 4% inflation => 31c now etc.
It would be nice to see the true savings always quoted in today's dollars, not just the nominal saving in future dollars.
That's my 2c.
Cheers, S/C
Freckle wrote:Matt_Arnold wrote:Eg. A $300,000 loan over 30 years at 5.98% paid fortnightly with an avetage of $10,000 in the offset account for the life of the loan will reduce the total interest payable by $45,575 !Jeez I hate these BS examples. The true power of Offset accounts are not in the piddley amounts of small change you might save over a time period but the ability to keep capital unencumbered so it can be deployed quickly with sensible amounts of leverage to generate a return. The above example is nominal not real because it fails to include the lost tax deductability which in effect reduces the end result considerably. Scale for inflation and the savings wouldn't buy a coffee once a week. People also need to realise that banks offer products usually in conjunction with other products. Mortgages that allow offset accounts can incurr higher rates, fees and other charges which can further erode the nominal offset rates.
freckle, offset accounts don't effect loan balances, only interest charges. In most cases offsetting a loan has little or no consequence on tax deductibility apart from if it is being used to offset interest in a tax deductible loan. In this scenario, in most cases, the money can be taken out of the offset fro any purpose without effecting the tax deductibility of that loan. It is very different in this regard to redraw or drawing on an LOC. They can, but often do not, come with higher rates.
And if you look closely you will discover that these inflation figures of 2.5-4% are BS.
APerry wrote:freckle, offset accounts don't effect loan balances, only interest charges. In most cases offsetting a loan has little or no consequence on tax deductibility apart from if it is being used to offset interest in a tax deductible loan. In this scenario, in most cases, the money can be taken out of the offset fro any purpose without effecting the tax deductibility of that loan. It is very different in this regard to redraw or drawing on an LOC. They can, but often do not, come with higher rates.Yep agree.
People also need to keep in mind that Offset a/c’s have constantly changing amounts depending on how they’re used. To manage them effectively to capitalise on interest offsets users need to fully understand the conditions in which a dollar counts towards an interest charge offset. It may take 30 days before a dollar qualifies and that may fall between certain time frames so the first part period may not count. IT can be very complicated for anyone to actually analyse these sorts of accounts but the use of simple calculators is often illusory.
@jamie, thanks for your article on IO loan for PPOR intention for my place to be an investment property in future. Good to know these tactics.
@terry, thanks for your examples, great to know the insights before delving in at the deep end.
@alistair, good article, learning heaps from you guys.
Cheers
zen
Great post guys! I am trying to soak up all the information i can these posts are gold!
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