like thongs( flip flops)?… hee heee… boot (trunk)? Jiro sandwich (donor kebab)… also cheerios (wieners)……just a few things to help break down the language barrier…..
Trust me being from NY and living in Charlotte NC the southern USA language compared to the Norhtern Lingo was hard for me to learn and I am from the USA …Good stuff on your first investment. Take it slow and keep us all updated,
Sincerely
Alex
1 – 3bed x 1bath for 24K 18% net return we have had this one since march …. 1 – 4×2 for 25K 23% purchased in august……………….. and 1 – 6×2 duplex on the way for 32K that could cashflow 27% these dwellings are in OK areas of a major city in Tenneesee
both of the houses took close to a month to find a quality tennant .. i have found some great property managment eventually . where i am focusing it is really hard to get your foot in the door on a good deal …it will only be on the market for a day and possibly… i was on the ground in the usa for a few months to organize this and 1 copy of the usa property power pack ..
here is a quote from my real estate agent talking about areas of a his city ….
It can go from GOOD to HOOD in 2 Blocks……
cheersJOHNBEC wrote:i have found some great property managment eventually .Hope it stays that way:) I know people who have been able to say that every 3-6 months or so:)
The absolutly most risky US real estate investment is the Super high cap rate multi family properties in the bigger mid west cities of the US.
Talking about a city in Tennesse is most likly talking about Memphis, and if you drive around memphis you will see 50% or better of the apartment complexes big and small boarded up, waiting for the next group of investors to come in and make a run at their cash cow 30% cap multi property. Only to have it boarded it up after they have lost hundreds of thousands and then the next group comes in. And its a never ending cycle.
For those on this Forum these super high cap rates are extemely risky and I can flat guarantee the only people that can make these work are ones that do it for a living and live with in miles of the properties. Have their own in house management that are employees and have full time security guards at the property.
Fact. over 50% of single family homes in Memphis are rentals. So the better renter goes for a SFR the worse renters end up in apartments. No one chooses to live in apartments in these areas they are forced there by income standards and usually super bad credit criminal backrgrounds. The high cap rate apartment is a constant turn over property as people come and go. A one year tenant would be long term.
Yes they can work but you need to run them like a prison literally. Duplex's not so much we buy some duplex's. but anything that is 10 untis and up and you have this sociodemographic living in units that are 20 feet apart, your talking major work.
Best play for these is to buy one fix it get it rented and then flip it to the new guy who see 's star's and thinks they will get this super high cap…. then in 2 years it will be boarded up again.
There is what has been called the Small House Movement starting here in the US and its effects are going to have a major impact on the way people live in mid-west cities that have been subject to urban sprawl. Kansas City comes to mind, simply put there were no physical boundaries to prevent developers from building pleasant suburbs within a reasonable drive from town. People given the same pocketbook often made the choice to buy a new house and send their children to the new school,.. I'm sure the story is familiar to everyone, sorry.
It is truly an ugly situation to buy an apartment building and end up having to take your lumps and throw in the towel, but imagine how it would be to be the tenant that never paid late and perhaps took time to help decorate for the holidays. Moving sucks.
In a "pocket neighborhood" a developer builds individual tiny houses – from 350' sq. to 1350' sq.- and places them on small lots. The effect is great. I always come back to energy costs, these houses address that issue. Efficient living, more simple living, less work to maintain, having a space that meets your needs…I would love to have tenants that find this appealing. In this situation individual tenants aren't a bad apple, they are not abusing community resources such as utilities, and liability issues are less and insurance is less. Even if the developer decides to have an HOA and provide a recreation/community center the costs and issues will be less than in a conventional apartment building. The developer can also sell individual homes, or sets of homes, and could opt to lease them.
With tax incentives and ever lowering costs for energy efficient choices; new small homes, tiny homes and cabins are going to be a popular choice. At over $3.00/gal for gas that commute from the suburbs is a cost many (most) Americans will consider.
On a more personal note, my son will soon be getting his Engineering degree. When in high school he and his smarty pants friends did not seem to care about getting a driver's license or to work out how to get a car. Some more affluent families gave their kid's cars. It seemed parents wanted their kids to get a license so they would stop asking for rides, or so they could help with siblings or errands.With the emergence of the laptop, we may be seeing an end of America's love affair with the automobile. It is just as well for environmental reasons but honestly the American automobile industry has been far from lovable.
Anyway check out Tumbleweed Tiny House Co., Texas Tiny Homes and Ross Chapin Architects on-line to see a range of possibilities
.do you take outside land deals for your web site I have 1 here in PDX and one in Atlanta I would like you to look at
I am in Portland and would be thrilled to look at a property here. The normal way we communicate with sellers is through this link
http://www.landtrustcompany.com/ there we provide a form to fill out with all the basic info so we can make a bid. Call me -I am in Pacific US time or contact me through the web site , my e-mail is here and there.Stu. Property is. http://Www.americanrealestateinvesting.com
5.5 mil option price. We are looking for a few equity partners. This property will sell north of 30 million in 5 to 7 years
Let me know what you think
Thank-you. I am very familiar with the area, my best friend worked at Jackson Middle school and managed apartments a few blocks from this project. I have forwarded the link to the powers that be. I will say this though, Metro does not always make friends where it goes and there is organized opposition to it development plans. Farmers and family businesses surviving in these tough times are not hip to having industry and its effluent moving in next door. Growth, progress and the opportunity for investors to make a buck are not as high a priority as maintaining community dynamics. Also, this development will require roads to be widened, more traffic equals more traffic control. In short Metro's development plans will most certainly inconvenience the people already in place, certain businesses holding on by a thread won't be able to survive the construction period. A company like Walmart, on the other hand, can bank on the potential, build a store and operate at a loss for two or three years while jobs and housing are created. This is a classic "not in my backyard" issue. Portland area grows by about 40,000 people per year. Locals would prefer learning the lessons of our recent past and would prefer Metro stop encouraging urban blight by having a comprehensive plan to create a complete community 40 minutes from town when there are empty buildings and entire blocks available in the NW industrial district and half empty office buildings in downtown. These locations already have the port of Portland, is at the hub of the highway system (I-5), adequate roads for high volume truck traffic, and has integrated rail.
OK, the cat is out of the bag, I do not like Metro's plan. Politicians want more revenue from taxes, corporate CEOs want to build and maintain a company town. Many people believe that the politicians are working for the money and that lobbying, campaigning, graft, corruption and blatantly selling out has replaced common sense and public service for the greater good. Imagine that, where do some people get their ideas?
Intel through its aggressive hiring and firing practices has made enemies of ex-employees and vendors as well as competitors. Their campus is a shining example of transforming an area.
Be careful.Stu good points vis a vi PDX land development politics.
I would agree that any property that is not targeting for future development like my property is in the catagory you describe.
Last April Portland Metro and the state ratifed the 50 year and 100 year Urban reserves and Rural Reserves. The Urban Reserves are ear marked for development starting in 2015. Matter of fact the property right across the st. was brought in the UGB in this latest round and is long range planned for Industrial and commercial.
Each city in the metro area by state law has to show 20 years of residental land avalaible for growth. And when one looks at a map of Hillsboro you will see that the town can only grow N. and S. The southern property has been brought in thats whats called the Sisters property. The ONLY residental expansion in the next 10 years will be North and our parcel is the very next one to come in.
It is IN the URBAN RESERVE and that is were by state law development will go. Also this parcel not being surrounded by existing development does not create the normal NIMBY attitudes. Evergreen the major east west road is slated for expansion and growth in the next 5 years as part of Washington County transportation plan. And Jackson School RD. Just had a 10 million dollar overpass built to allow traffic to flow off and on the freeway.
This property is not an If its a When. Metro learned its lesson last go around bringing in a bunch of land that could not be serviced and never was developed or never will be ( Damascus) for lack of infrastructure. Our property has main line Sewer Water power and transportation.
This project has no bearing on what happens in the downtown PDX Urban setting.
As for Intel, That company has single handily kept Oregon alive. They are building the New Fab 5 right down the st. from us 3 billion to buld it. Put 4,000 people to work. and will employee 2,000 full time. Without Intel Oregon would be in really really sad shape.
As a matter of fact one of my new constructions is being shown today to an Intel engineer that just transferred from Dallis TX. There is going to be a nice rebound in Washington county as Intel brings in these new jobs.
Roger Pollock at Buena Vista homes bought this same dirt for 7 million in 04… The only reason we got it is because of the meltdown of 07 08 09… If you remember he sold out and went to Mexico. he was the 3rd largest builder in the Metro area at the time.
Interested to hear your powers to be feedback once they get all the facts about whats happend with the Urban Reserves and Rural Reserves and once they study where and what can actually be developed.
By the way as you know PDX Metro has been hell on Walmart. They just won't let them in for big box stores. With this down turn a bunch of commercial closed as you know and Wal mart very quielty bought 19 smaller super market type stores and plans to open mimi wall marts all accross the metro area.
I know my Haggens in Murray hill closed and Wal mart bought them.
Walmart is in the process of filling what was the Lake Grove Natures. I'm still not an Intel fan. I think our discussion is becoming a bit esoteric , parochial, I can't say that I agree that this west side development will not effect Portland NW industrial or downtown.How will adding several thousand jobs and residential units not effect the entire region? Orenco Station does not effect downtown Beaverton? See my comment from Dec. 16, this type of project contributes to urban blight, in fact it is a definitive element in the process.
One last note, money spent on a bridge over Highway 26 to accommodate potential traffic on the outer west side would have been better spent on the Sellwood Bridge an essential artery…all done.
jayhinrichs wrote:The absolutly most risky US real estate investment is the Super high cap rate multi family properties in the bigger mid west cities of the US.— I don't know that I would neccesairly agree with this statement. The midwest is the best area to invest if you are looking for cash flow, always has been and always will be. The midwest offers something no other region can, and that's tenants in massive numbers. This is the very 1st rule of business after all, be where the customers are. But to be fair, if your looking to buy and sell, there are much better options than the midwest (well except maybe Dallas, geez that place is tearing it up), I'll be the first to admit that.Talking about a city in Tennesse is most likly talking about Memphis, and if you drive around memphis you will see 50% or better of the apartment complexes big and small boarded up, waiting for the next group of investors to come in and make a run at their cash cow 30% cap multi property. Only to have it boarded it up after they have lost hundreds of thousands and then the next group comes in. And its a never ending cycle.—I really can't speak to Memphis, as I have not studied that market, but I have heard things from both sides of the fence. If any MF deal is being advertised at 30% CAP, then there should be major flags being thrown. This number is simply not attainable in apartments, without making serious cuts to the renovation, in which case that property will not perform at 15% CAP, let alone 30%. I know there are those that seem to believe that because they say it, then it must be true,and it's too bad that it is that way. Of the complex's I am partners in, we consistently see high teen returns, I imagine we could get this number into the low 20s, but since we do convert to all electric, this is a major expense in an apartment complex and causes are NETs to drop a few points.
For those on this Forum these super high cap rates are extemely risky and I can flat guarantee the only people that can make these work are ones that do it for a living and live with in miles of the properties. Have their own in house management that are employees and have full time security guards at the property.— The properties are only risky, if they are not professionally managed and renovated. The deal never fails (unless you overpay), it always comes back to management or the renovation, that caused the failure. My associates and I have bought and renovated several properties in this exact scenario that you describe, a local investor bought it, renovated it as cheap as possible and thought that management was "EASY". In fact the building we close on next month, is this exact scenario. This owner had no mangement experience, renovated these units as cheap as possible, and was broke within 5 years, as he could not get the rents where they needed to be, and constantly paying for maintenance as well as renting to the wrong tenant.
Property management is pretty easy for those that have the experience in dealing with tenants, and understand that you have to think like a tenant, not an investor. To toot my own horn, this is why I do exit polling, I can't think like a tenant without polling tenants, as I have not been a tenant for over 20 years.Fact. over 50% of single family homes in Memphis are rentals. So the better renter goes for a SFR the worse renters end up in apartments. No one chooses to live in apartments in these areas they are forced there by income standards and usually super bad credit criminal backrgrounds. The high cap rate apartment is a constant turn over property as people come and go. A one year tenant would be long term.—From my experience in dealing with apartments, the information seems to suggest otherwise. The tenants tend to stay longer in apartments than they do houses. I cannot speak to Memphis, and maybe this is reversed there. What I am seeing with tenants, is they are starting to understand the costs involved in renting a house, it is about 30% higher to rent a house than it is an apartment, and they are wising up and moving to apartments. Those that are choosing houses over apartmetns, are doing it solely for the fact they need the room, due to children. As far as the worse tenants being those in apartments, I have seen no data to support that here in KC. There are plenty enough bad tenants to go around, if turnover is that big of a problem….that can be directly placed in the lap of the manager. There are simply to many quality tools available to propery managers these days, that making a sound decision on a tenant is not a difficult process anymore.
Yes they can work but you need to run them like a prison literally. Duplex's not so much we buy some duplex's. but anything that is 10 untis and up and you have this sociodemographic living in units that are 20 feet apart, your talking major work.–The one key factor to remember is when you do a professional renovation, this by default, raises the rents to top of the market or just above. This will eliminate alot of the problem tenants associated with lower rent buildings, as they will never qualify, if for no other reason than their income does not meet the requirements. This is how you eliminate the very things you talk about, don't do cheap renovations, so that you can't get to the top of the market in rents, and can only rent to those questionable tenants.
As far as dealing with the multiple personailities, this is much easier to do when your dealing with tenants who actually have respectable jobs, and just don't qualify to buy a home these days (who does?). These tenants simply stay to themselves and live their lives like a responsible person should. When you ask top of the market for rent, these are the tenants you will end up with, as they are the only group that can afford it.Best play for these is to buy one fix it get it rented and then flip it to the new guy who see 's star's and thinks they will get this super high cap…. then in 2 years it will be boarded up again.—I don't know about that, you risk giving up several 100s of thuosands of dollars in equity, trying to retail flip an apartment building these days. There simply is no retail market for apartments, and investors are looking to pay 60-80% of value for buildings. If you wait for the market to turn ( and it will at least twice as fast as the residential market will) you will capitialize very nicely on your apartment building. [/quote]
Have a great day!
I obviously don't see eye to eye with Jay, just read the most recent posts here, however, Kansas City, really, I own a lot there. The author unknown in the above wrote
Property management is pretty easy for those that have the experience in dealing with tenants, and understand that you have to think like a tenant, not an investor. To toot my own horn, this is why I do exit polling, I can't think like a tenant without polling tenants, as I have not been a tenant for over 20 years.PROPERTY MANAGEMENT IS NEVER EASY THAT IS WHY OWNERS PAY GOOD MONEY FOR THE SERVICE, TENANTS ARE ALWAYS VEXING. Before becoming a homeowner I was a renter for the better part of two decades, several apartment in two states. I was vexing to the owners. It is easy to think like a tenant, Needs come first, if circumstances require me to move and my budget is tight then I gather my funds to establish my new place and make the move at the expense of rent and utilities. I may or may not feel bad about it and I may even hope to eventually make good. This is why tenants are required to pay last month's rent up front, is it not?
BuyLandOnLine wrote:I obviously don't see eye to eye with Jay, just read the most recent posts here, however, Kansas City, really, I own a lot there. The author unknown in the above wrote
Property management is pretty easy for those that have the experience in dealing with tenants, and understand that you have to think like a tenant, not an investor. To toot my own horn, this is why I do exit polling, I can't think like a tenant without polling tenants, as I have not been a tenant for over 20 years.PROPERTY MANAGEMENT IS NEVER EASY THAT IS WHY OWNERS PAY GOOD MONEY FOR THE SERVICE, TENANTS ARE ALWAYS VEXING. Before becoming a homeowner I was a renter for the better part of two decades, several apartment in two states. I was vexing to the owners. It is easy to think like a tenant, Needs come first, if circumstances require me to move and my budget is tight then I gather my funds to establish my new place and make the move at the expense of rent and utilities. I may or may not feel bad about it and I may even hope to eventually make good. This is why tenants are required to pay last month's rent up front, is it not?
I guess PM is as easy as you want to make it, or as hard as you want to make it. For me, it's not all that challenging, because I use the tools that are provided, to keep some kind of control on the headaches. There is no 100% sure fire method, as there are those that slip thru the cracks, but if a PM is actually doing a professional job, these should be few and far between.
John
Thank-you John. Like most things, if your good at something it is easier. When I was an educator and counselor working with gang effected teenagers it was easy to get up for work and easy to feel good about what I did, the work…well, it was never easy but most of my college educated friends thought the job seemed impossible let alone difficult.If you are an effective PM then you are obviously taking to heart what people say in those exit polls and care about the conditions within which they live. in the long run happier tenants make fewer problems. and that in turn reduces costs and keeps the rent flowing and makes for happy owners. It is an old fashioned idea that good business keeps everyone happy not just merely satisfied. Your buildings likely have a good reputation, on the street where the renters lurk, and among owners. Keep up the good work'
Did urban sprawl lead to urban blight and is that as large a problem as it hasbeen made out to be in KC?.BuyLandOnLine wrote:Thank-you John. Like most things, if your good at something it is easier. When I was an educator and counselor working with gang effected teenagers it was easy to get up for work and easy to feel good about what I did, the work…well, it was never easy but most of my college educated friends thought the job seemed impossible let alone difficult.If you are an effective PM then you are obviously taking to heart what people say in those exit polls and care about the conditions within which they live. in the long run happier tenants make fewer problems. and that in turn reduces costs and keeps the rent flowing and makes for happy owners. It is an old fashioned idea that good business keeps everyone happy not just merely satisfied. Your buildings likely have a good reputation, on the street where the renters lurk, and among owners. Keep up the good work'
Did urban sprawl lead to urban blight and is that as large a problem as it hasbeen made out to be in KC?.unfortunatly white flight
GreaterKCHomes wrote:jayhinrichs wrote:The absolutly most risky US real estate investment is the Super high cap rate multi family properties in the bigger mid west cities of the US.— I don't know that I would neccesairly agree with this statement. The midwest is the best area to invest if you are looking for cash flow, always has been and always will be. The midwest offers something no other region can, and that's tenants in massive numbers. This is the very 1st rule of business after all, be where the customers are. But to be fair, if your looking to buy and sell, there are much better options than the midwest (well except maybe Dallas, geez that place is tearing it up), I'll be the first to admit that.Talking about a city in Tennesse is most likly talking about Memphis, and if you drive around memphis you will see 50% or better of the apartment complexes big and small boarded up, waiting for the next group of investors to come in and make a run at their cash cow 30% cap multi property. Only to have it boarded it up after they have lost hundreds of thousands and then the next group comes in. And its a never ending cycle.—I really can't speak to Memphis, as I have not studied that market, but I have heard things from both sides of the fence. If any MF deal is being advertised at 30% CAP, then there should be major flags being thrown. This number is simply not attainable in apartments, without making serious cuts to the renovation, in which case that property will not perform at 15% CAP, let alone 30%. I know there are those that seem to believe that because they say it, then it must be true,and it's too bad that it is that way. Of the complex's I am partners in, we consistently see high teen returns, I imagine we could get this number into the low 20s, but since we do convert to all electric, this is a major expense in an apartment complex and causes are NETs to drop a few points.
For those on this Forum these super high cap rates are extemely risky and I can flat guarantee the only people that can make these work are ones that do it for a living and live with in miles of the properties. Have their own in house management that are employees and have full time security guards at the property.— The properties are only risky, if they are not professionally managed and renovated. The deal never fails (unless you overpay), it always comes back to management or the renovation, that caused the failure. My associates and I have bought and renovated several properties in this exact scenario that you describe, a local investor bought it, renovated it as cheap as possible and thought that management was "EASY". In fact the building we close on next month, is this exact scenario. This owner had no mangement experience, renovated these units as cheap as possible, and was broke within 5 years, as he could not get the rents where they needed to be, and constantly paying for maintenance as well as renting to the wrong tenant.
Property management is pretty easy for those that have the experience in dealing with tenants, and understand that you have to think like a tenant, not an investor. To toot my own horn, this is why I do exit polling, I can't think like a tenant without polling tenants, as I have not been a tenant for over 20 years.Fact. over 50% of single family homes in Memphis are rentals. So the better renter goes for a SFR the worse renters end up in apartments. No one chooses to live in apartments in these areas they are forced there by income standards and usually super bad credit criminal backrgrounds. The high cap rate apartment is a constant turn over property as people come and go. A one year tenant would be long term.—From my experience in dealing with apartments, the information seems to suggest otherwise. The tenants tend to stay longer in apartments than they do houses. I cannot speak to Memphis, and maybe this is reversed there. What I am seeing with tenants, is they are starting to understand the costs involved in renting a house, it is about 30% higher to rent a house than it is an apartment, and they are wising up and moving to apartments. Those that are choosing houses over apartmetns, are doing it solely for the fact they need the room, due to children. As far as the worse tenants being those in apartments, I have seen no data to support that here in KC. There are plenty enough bad tenants to go around, if turnover is that big of a problem….that can be directly placed in the lap of the manager. There are simply to many quality tools available to propery managers these days, that making a sound decision on a tenant is not a difficult process anymore.
Yes they can work but you need to run them like a prison literally. Duplex's not so much we buy some duplex's. but anything that is 10 untis and up and you have this sociodemographic living in units that are 20 feet apart, your talking major work.–The one key factor to remember is when you do a professional renovation, this by default, raises the rents to top of the market or just above. This will eliminate alot of the problem tenants associated with lower rent buildings, as they will never qualify, if for no other reason than their income does not meet the requirements. This is how you eliminate the very things you talk about, don't do cheap renovations, so that you can't get to the top of the market in rents, and can only rent to those questionable tenants.
As far as dealing with the multiple personailities, this is much easier to do when your dealing with tenants who actually have respectable jobs, and just don't qualify to buy a home these days (who does?). These tenants simply stay to themselves and live their lives like a responsible person should. When you ask top of the market for rent, these are the tenants you will end up with, as they are the only group that can afford it.Best play for these is to buy one fix it get it rented and then flip it to the new guy who see 's star's and thinks they will get this super high cap…. then in 2 years it will be boarded up again.—I don't know about that, you risk giving up several 100s of thuosands of dollars in equity, trying to retail flip an apartment building these days. There simply is no retail market for apartments, and investors are looking to pay 60-80% of value for buildings. If you wait for the market to turn ( and it will at least twice as fast as the residential market will) you will capitialize very nicely on your apartment building. [/quote]
Have a great day!
KC
Your a professional who works the business everyday, my comments are targeted to the Owner investor thinking they are going to buy a boarded up building in the mid west for 5k a door that the broker has written proforma on showing 15% to 20% cap rates.
Price is low enough to entice the investor that is unaware of how difficult these properties are to manage.
If someone wants to PARTNER with YOU aand you had personal FINANCIAL risk and they vetted you as a person with FINANCIAL capability and exerience then I think that is a much better play for most investors. And most investors should pay YOU a premium for this experitise and FINANCIAL risk that you take when your recommending a deal.
There is no question an art and experince level to owning multi family that is class B C D which is what i think we are talking about.
At the end of the day No property manager in US is going to personally pay for anything out of their personal pocket vis a vi the running cost of any property.
At the end of the day those buying in the single family realm on the low end cash flow rentals will deal with the ups and downs.
Stu,
I think Portland in the next 20 years will be like many Metro plex's its too big to think that all development has to happen in downtown. Like Kruse way has taken commercial.
Its better to have housing closer to the Jobs and Washington county Hillsboro is the Silicon Forest, There is no physical room in or close to downtown to accomodate any type of CLEAN industry like High tech.
The majority buildable acres in the Portland metro area is for better or worse where are property is located.
Portland and Oregon along with Multnomah county have taxed themselves into a NON business environment. Thats why so many business's have either left the state or left Mulnomah county. big timber left.,, boeing, etc etc.
any way enough on that. We are very please with our path of progress play and just wanted to share….
Will be no problem rounding up a few PDX investors that know the market and the land use politics
I post this mainly for the AUssies to see what kind of options their are instead of buying low end rentals that really will never have the up side as well place land deals, I think on that we AGREE right
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