All Topics / Legal & Accounting / Chan & Naylor Accountants – Reviews?

Viewing 20 posts - 1 through 20 (of 30 total)
  • Profile photo of trevmanoxtrevmanox
    Member
    @trevmanox
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 2

    Hey All,

    Apologies if this has been asked/quoted before but in doing searches i'm finding lots of disparate info. We're based in Melbourne – inner city.

    I'm wondering if anyone has experience with Chan and Naylor? and more importantly what their experience was like.

    From what i can see quite frankly they charge like wounded bulls! but i can see some people vehemently recommending them as being amazing………

    Just wondering because we are looking for an Accountant – long term who specialises in Property investment and Such, but i'm not thrilled about parting with thousands of dollars for an acountant – having said that – i'm happy to pay this if indeed they are!

    Comments please?

    Profile photo of KuradjiKuradji
    Member
    @kuradji
    Join Date: 2009
    Post Count: 34

    Hi
    I used the Sydney mob. (Pymble)
    Paid the $500-ish for the financial assessment.
    It took 2 hours and the guy was very personable, but I got nothing out of it.
    Also you have to fill out forms so they know everything about you before you go, but of course in my case the guy I was supposed to see was replaced at the last moment with someone else who had not read any of my documents and found it difficult to get on top of all my bits and pieces – I never said my finances were straightforward A-B-C – which is why I was trying to get some really good advice from people who seemed to say they could think outside the norm.
    So I travelled for 2 hours in horrific Sydney morning traffic, was there 2 hours, paid $500 and wasted my day.

    Profile photo of trevmanoxtrevmanox
    Member
    @trevmanox
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 2
    Kuradji wrote:
    Hi I used the Sydney mob. (Pymble) Paid the $500-ish for the financial assessment. It took 2 hours and the guy was very personable, but I got nothing out of it. Also you have to fill out forms so they know everything about you before you go, but of course in my case the guy I was supposed to see was replaced at the last moment with someone else who had not read any of my documents and found it difficult to get on top of all my bits and pieces – I never said my finances were straightforward A-B-C – which is why I was trying to get some really good advice from people who seemed to say they could think outside the norm. So I travelled for 2 hours in horrific Sydney morning traffic, was there 2 hours, paid $500 and wasted my day.

    And that's exactly what i'm afraid of with the Chain-structure of these types – it's a little too much like a sausage-machine – i;m after someone who won't palm me off to another who knows nothing about me, and open to paying these rates for the privilege too.

    Profile photo of trusteetrustee
    Member
    @trustee
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 27

    Hi, I agree with Kuradji,

    C&N make a big deal out of getting people to their Financial Health Checks charge $395 for what many times could be disclosed over the phone or a ten minute meeting.  Often and in general most people would not need a trust set up for property unless they have a complex business or personal situation to deal with or multiple investments.  Another reason maybe where the person is in an occupation such as a surgeon and therefore needs protection from being sued.  The first or second time property investor is better off on a land tax basis to just invest in their own names.  A lot of this information is really quite basic and does not require a FHC. (financial health check) C & N also overcharge for the setup of these trusts.  On the whole it is simply a gimmic to get people in the door and have them become clients.

    Not to say they cannot give relevant advice to complex situations but for the novice it is simply a waste of money as many people could testify to if they had access to this site and told of their experiences.   In addition their new move into the SMSF field is simply a money spinner.  The trusts they use are someone elses branded as their own and marked up by 2-300%.   Do your own due diligence and check elsewhere for help at a much lower cost.

    Profile photo of Greg ReidGreg Reid
    Member
    @greg-reid
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 91

    I have clients in Melbourne who previously had taken advice by C&N and it has not worked to their advantage. Both are PAYG salaried and little risk of being sued, they now have 3 hybrid trusts with one IP in each.

    It just looks to me selling a product and fitting the advice to suit the sale.

    It does not help their portfolio development.

    I am sure there are better out there.

    Good luck

    Greg

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    There are many people out there with HDTs, from a variety of suppliers, who have huge problems – many don't even know it yet. One guy told me it would cost him $100,000 to fix – he got his from a melbourne accountant.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of Mr5o1Mr5o1
    Participant
    @mr5o1
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 107
    Greg Reid wrote:
    I have clients in Melbourne who previously had taken advice by C&N and it has not worked to their advantage. Both are PAYG salaried and little risk of being sued, they now have 3 hybrid trusts with one IP in each.
    It just looks to me selling a product and fitting the advice to suit the sale.
    It does not help their portfolio development.

    I am sure there are better out there.
    Good luck
    Greg

    +1

    Whilst I have no direct experience with C&N, I have noticed a tendency towards “sales based accounting” with larger firms. “come in for one of our overpriced financial health checks”, “oh you need a company / trust structure for this”, “you definitely need a family trust for that”.

    Profile photo of trusteetrustee
    Member
    @trustee
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 27

    Mr501 you are so right on the money with C&N.  They are now doing the same thing with SMSF trust deeds.  Making out it is there own product but using someone else's and marking it up 300%    Check out the competition first.  These guys make heaps out of suckering new clients in through their seminars for health checks and then try to get them as long term clients with no CRM and no care policy after that.

    Profile photo of getsmartgetsmart
    Member
    @getsmart
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 4

    Hi trevmanox, do you know how much do they normally charge? also slightly off topic, has anyone here tried BANTACS?

    Profile photo of trusteetrustee
    Member
    @trustee
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 27

    Chan and Naylors fees can be accessed from their website.

    Profile photo of wealth4life.comwealth4life.com
    Member
    @wealth4life.com
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 1,248

    Bantacs yes !!

    C&N are too technical and too expensive … keep it simple … asset protection is quite basic.

    D

    Profile photo of crustycrusty
    Participant
    @crusty
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 127

       I went to one ot the C&N  semminars, at some  expense and inconvenience, and was rather disapointed with the quality of some of the information. Some of the information was excellent, but some was inacurrate and I learnt  I was  doing things that  they said  cant be done.   Even though my acountant says they can and the ATO never had a problem when they did an audit.        I  felt they were just pushing expensive and unnecessary products, though some have aplace in certain situations.  

    Profile photo of ToucheTouche
    Member
    @touche
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 6

    Hi

    I attended a free seminar held by Guests Accounting early this week regarding the latest changes to trusts and find it quite useful. 

    I'm going to have a free consultation with one of their Accountants next week.

    You might want to do the same. 

    I've seen C & N but I want a second opinion and that is why I am seeing this Accountant.

    Profile photo of littleaussielittleaussie
    Participant
    @littleaussie
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 27

    Hi,
    If  you happen to come to Bendigo, our accountant Mark Hernan is fantastic. He will set up your structures in the most cost effective way, suitable to your circumstances.
     ex. We were going to do what Chan & Naylor said and have separate trusts for each property with a corporate trustee in each, at a cost of thousands of dollars in set up fees and also ongoing accounting fees and ASIC fees.
    When I spoke to Mark ( our accountant) he looked at what we were doing and said that we could be the trustees – no need to set up separate companies for each!! Also provided that the gross yearly income for each trust was under 75K we can have more than one property in each trust without having to register for GST..
    We've been using his discretionary trust for 2 years and have had no worries. Hope you find someone who can help you too.
    Good Luck.

    Profile photo of littleaussielittleaussie
    Participant
    @littleaussie
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 27

    Forgot to mention, Mark has been our accountant for our Business ( Bakery) for the past 6 years. He maximises your deductions and does everything he can for the benefit of his clients.

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    There is less asset protection by having personal trustees. If the trustee is sued his or her personal assets are at risk. Also less flexibility with changing things – if you want to change trustees, then the title will need to be changed and theloan will need to be changed. There may be stamp duty consequences too. But it does give some asset protection and makes it easier to get a loan.

    Residential rents are GST free, so as long as you have residential property there should be no GST issues – unless you are building and selling.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of number 8number 8
    Participant
    @number-8
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 333

    I agree, I  have a partnership at general law and income is over $75k but there is no need for GST registration.

    Corporate trustees are nearly always a must with trust structures in case of death / divorce and like.

    As a rule, I am not an advocate of complex structures for the many, but C&N have some legitimate reasons for their methods albeit they are a little over-priced.

    http://www.birchcorp.com.au

    Profile photo of st81hp79st81hp79
    Member
    @st81hp79
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 35
    Kuradji wrote:
    Hi I used the Sydney mob. (Pymble) Paid the $500-ish for the financial assessment. It took 2 hours and the guy was very personable, but I got nothing out of it. Also you have to fill out forms so they know everything about you before you go, but of course in my case the guy I was supposed to see was replaced at the last moment with someone else who had not read any of my documents and found it difficult to get on top of all my bits and pieces – I never said my finances were straightforward A-B-C – which is why I was trying to get some really good advice from people who seemed to say they could think outside the norm. So I travelled for 2 hours in horrific Sydney morning traffic, was there 2 hours, paid $500 and wasted my day.

    I Had the same experience but with C&N, on the time of my appointment the financial planner told me that they haven't received my Assessment Form from head office.
    Luckily.. I brought along a copy in my bag, they were trying to read quickly flicking through my assessment Form.  They should have requested another copy from head office  for them to review before the appointment.

    I spent $395 for a Financial Health Check but half of the session before seeing an accountant was spent going through  my assessment Form with a financial planner.

    Well.. I am still searching for a good accountant( Melbourne), who genuinely is a property investor them self and is interested in helping there clients.

    Profile photo of harryandlloydharryandlloyd
    Member
    @harryandlloyd
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 20

    <font color=”#000000″>Feel compelled to add my two cents to this post given my FHC with Chan and Naylor two weeks ago at their Surry Hills office.

    I bought a copy of 'How to Legally Reduce your Tax' by C&N and was quite intrigued about trust structures and the benefits that result if one changes their mindset from a 'pawn' to a 'player' in the game of tax.

    My 2.5hr session focused on income streams, tax flexibilty, asset protection and estate planning and it took me those whole 2.5hrs, the walk back to my hotel and an additional 2 weeks of solid googling, print research and further professional advice (thankfully free!) to comprehend the pros and cons of investing via a trust structure.

    My laymans advice is this: Seriously consider your circumstance!

    ie. life stage,

    employment type and status (employee/employer? cleaner/surgeon?),

    short and long term investment goals and

    family planning before diving into the unknown purely on the advice of an industry salesman…a-hem, I mean professional!

    I am 32, single, an employee and have (due to circumstance) no children, now or in the future.

    I am purchasing my first IP – as an individual – in the coming weeks and will review my structure should I acquire more properties in the future. 

    Quite frankly, I wish I had found this site (especially the forums!) and committed myself to more diligent research before parting company with $395 clams. Oh how I live and learn!

    Regards

    Kate</font>

    Profile photo of Alistair PerryAlistair Perry
    Participant
    @aperry
    Join Date: 2004
    Post Count: 891
    Touche wrote:

    Hi

    I attended a free seminar held by Guests Accounting early this week regarding the latest changes to trusts and find it quite useful. 

    I'm going to have a free consultation with one of their Accountants next week.

    You might want to do the same. 

    I've seen C & N but I want a second opinion and that is why I am seeing this Accountant.

    I've used Guests for years. They are absolutely fantastic, I can't speak highly enough of them.

Viewing 20 posts - 1 through 20 (of 30 total)

You must be logged in to reply to this topic. If you don't have an account, you can register here.