- merryc wrote:oneplumber wrote:The media reckon Doctors kill more people then Electricians.
Good point. Maybe if we gave Doctors beer when they treated us, they might do better too.
VERY FUNNY!
Try to engage a sparky and or plumber who have just commenced in business themselves. They R trying to get a business going so there prices would b O/K. I have no trouble with mine ,Young fellow going out by himself.
Geoff frtom P/W
merryc wrote:oneplumber wrote:The media reckon Doctors kill more people then Electricians.Good point. Maybe if we gave Doctors beer when they treated us, they might do better too.
Bwhahahahaha thats gold!!!!!!
blogs wrote:anyone else find it strange that sparkies are comparing themselves to doctors? Talk about getting a grip……you need to get a grip allright. sparkies get paid more than doctors. we dont compare ourselves to anyone.
I remember a few years ago when I was working in Sydneys eastern suburbs. Clients (who were doctors and lawyers) would look down their nose at me and say “what the hell do you know, you’re just a sparky”
A few years on, I will tell you what I know. Im now getting paid more than you, smartarse!
crashy wrote:blogs wrote:anyone else find it strange that sparkies are comparing themselves to doctors? Talk about getting a grip……you need to get a grip allright. sparkies get paid more than doctors. we dont compare ourselves to anyone. I remember a few years ago when I was working in Sydneys eastern suburbs. Clients (who were doctors and lawyers) would look down their nose at me and say "what the hell do you know, you're just a sparky" A few years on, I will tell you what I know. Im now getting paid more than you, smartarse!
Never fails to amuse me how 'precious' tradies can be-I wasnt looking down my nose at you, why would I? I do however find it nuts that the ad your union is running seems to imply that your training should be comparable to that of a doctor. Now that is crazy-do you have ANY idea of the amount of study, training and information those guys have to absorb over a 7 year period?? It is unbelieveable. Electronics on the other hand, well sorry but it aint that tough-and yes I can speak from experiance..
crashy wrote:I remember a few years ago when I was working in Sydneys eastern suburbs. Clients (who were doctors and lawyers) would look down their nose at me and say "what the hell do you know, you're just a sparky"What were they talking to you about? Was it in regards to a medical/law issue? In that case of course they would be right, however if it was to do with something to do with finace etc then they are obviously pretensious wankers and who cares what they think…
I am still waiting to read anything remotely enlightening about this whole thread…
Years ago when I introduced my friend who was a lawyer, to my hubby who is a plumber she commented to me that even though my hubby was just a plumber she liked him and she could have an intelligent conversation with him.
I find this hillarious! He is just a person who finished school, decided uni wasn't for him, wanted a secure high paying job, and didn't want to be on the dole. He completed an apprenticeship (studied hard and topped the class), and got a job.
Just because he chose not to go to university doesn't make him dumb or less of a person. You get good and bad tradies just like every other profession.
Now my lawyer friend has changed professions, avoids hanging out with a lot of other lawyers as she finds they think how she used to think.
I don't think every tradesperson is smart and professional but I'm sure there is plenty of good ones and some of the above comments are narrowminded and offensive to the many good tradies. I'm not trying to offend anyone who is a professional, just trying to pointing out that there is good and bad in every profession and maybe in general tradies should be respected and not treated as though they are dumb and less worthy.mackar wrote:I am still waiting to read anything remotely enlightening about this whole thread…Well thankfully you have posted and now we can all walk away feeling 'enlightened' lol, thank you!!
millions wrote:some of the above comments are narrowminded and offensive to the many good tradies.Millions please point out one single comment in this entire thread that makes a comment that infers that tradies are any less intelligent that 'graduates'??? Please just one??? Why is it that whenever a comment is made about a tradies level of service or professionalism all of a sudden it is taken to be an attack on their intelligence or stature? Inferiority complex in some maybe, but its hard to look down your nose at them when most are earning more than the majority of white collar workers!!
ttman wrote:I don't know about fellow property investors, but I am sick to my stomach the extortionist fees charged by plumbers & electricians : $250 to change a light socket, $300 to change a cistern. Fair dinkum, do these people think they are brain surgeons or something. Together with SOME kickback receiving property managers doesn't help. Call out fee $88, at 5.01 pm charge weekend rate at double, the list go on & on. One time I have a plumber charged me $90 to tell me I need a new hot water unit. I know I can always get a second quote but sometimes it's not possible such as if the property is interstate or overseas, or if the tradies collude with each other. As property investors we need to think of a better way as these exorbitant tradie fees put a real dent to the cashflow. I hate being ripped off. I think of the followings to deal with this most unpleasant aspect of investing in residential property :
1. The reason plumbers and electricians can ask for exorbitant money because one doesn't know the cost for a repair job,
if this web site (or some smart web genius) can list the cost for all repair jobs then one can compare if the quote is
reasonable. Also it will be good if we can recommend honest tradies to fellow investors.
2. Relax most electrical & plumbing jobs so un-licensed handyman can do. Also open the flood gate to foreign tradesmen
as tradies in most countries are not as spoiled as in Oz. (In Mexico they have to queue every morning for jobs to earn few
dollars a day !)
3. Reduce the length of apprenticeship to one year. There is not much to learn in plumbing and electrical.One last question, are you sick of greedy plumbers & electricians ?
Hi bloggs – just a general vibe I was getting.
millions wrote:Hi bloggs – just a general vibe I was getting.Thats cool-but I think you are confusing the issue, by people stating that plumbing or electrical work is easy it isnt saying that plumbers and electricians are any less intelligent than anyone else. As for plumbing it is a bloody toughf job with not so great conditions at times, but to say it is a complex and difficult job isnt necessarily true-this isnt to say though that some bong smoking uni grad is any more intelligent, just that the actual job they are doing isnt that complicated. Hell I have mates I went to school with who had t.e.r.s of 85 and are in trades. I think tradies worry more about how people judge them then anyone else.
I couldnt really give a stuff-all I care about as Ive said before is getting what I pay for-charge professional fees deliver professional service and I'll be happy as larry
Professinalism and respect and a great sense of humour would help save this thread.
Doctors dislike Chiro’s
Investors dislike unprofessional tradies
Criminals dislike cops
Bosses dislike ambitious young workers
bla, bla, bla, blaTry not to compare a collective politically motivated add about the industry with the great community service electricians supply to the public.
Plumbers joke that we enjoy a better trade then Electricians, but the fact of the matter is we would rather service your waste then play with electricity – something we cannot SEE!
Yes we can learn and I have met a few unlucky Electricians who have had to retire because they did the 240 Volt dance a few times, but you choose a direction in life and then you commit.
Commitment to being an Electrician, a life skill, is the same as committing to investing. Do it right or get burnt.
William Price
Lic. Plumber, Drainer & Gasfitter.
Bachelor of Commerce.
Certified Business Coach.PS: I would love to achieve my Law degree.
Too many people here are hung up on IQ's. " tradies are just as smart as professionals neer neer neer".
I realise that there is this academic snobbery happening in this country that encourages us to push our kids to uni. Bottom line is if you are the academic kind it is expected you will go to uni, if not, you will look at alternatives such as trades.I am encouraging my four boys to take up a trade. They are all average intelligence and I doubt any of them will want to spend four years churning out essays even if they achieved a high OP score. IQ has nothing to do with to do with general knowledge, sense of humour, positive outlooks,common sense, social skills,ambition or anything else that would encourage a happy and fulfilling life. I am reminded of a school mate, extremely average academically, but went on to start a major pizza chain here in qld. Now he didn't have a degree OR a trade.
I haven't told my boys to shut the door on uni, just to wait to be sure of what they want to do. Continuing education and career change have become much more prevalent. AND Ive discovered that a diploma in any trade is the equivalent to a tertiary entrance score of between 6 and 10 in the queensland OP system. I've never seen a condescending attitude by professionals toward tradespeople (and yes I went to uni)Some students might adopt a superior attitude but it doesnt last as they grow more comfortable in their own skin and gain more life skills.
How many uni students does it take to change a light bulb?
Only one but it takes nine years to do it.oh and ttman, is it just me or do others keep seeing an 'i' between those 't's?
Milly wrote:I am encouraging my four boys to take up a trade. They are all average intelligence and I doubt any of them will want to spend four years churning out essays even if they achieved a high OP score. IQ has nothing to do with to do with general knowledge, sense of humour, positive outlooks,common sense, social skills,ambition or anything else that would encourage a happy and fulfilling life.Good for you, and if I had kids I would do the same. Maybe you havent seen some of my other posts about my views on uni-put it this way, who is the sucker-the apprentice who gets PAID to learn and comes out at the end earning a stack of money, or the uni student who PAYS to learn to graduate and then try to find a job and earn peanuts for a few years. I think tradies are EXTREMLEY smart!!!!
Oh Oneplumber, don't forget to add into your list 'stay at home mothers versus working mothers (by choice), lol. The comparisons are everywhere and everyone has their own opinion and agenda.
I may be only 31 but i have learnt along the way not to judge anyone until i have walked in their shoes. I use to frown at mothers who told their kids off in public or ignored their childs crying…. until i became a mother and can now see that nothing is black and white and we all do the best we can.
I know someone who failed year ten, but is now a multi multi millionaire with a nice porsche updated regularly. (he started out in trade and now runs a lucrative business with many employees due to a niche market and specialised skill). People still comment on how he was never that smart at school (like he doesn't deserve it).
Just because someone has a degree or a high IQ doesn't mean they deserve to earn a high income. I worked with lawyers for many years and i could not think of a more boring job in my life.
If you go to a parenting forum noboby would be debating 'stay at home versus work' why… because it's a never ending debate. Each to their own i say… whatever floats your boat as my son would say, lol. Whatever my son decides to do for a job, i hope he enjoys it and earns enough to pay for a nice house and support a family one day. as long as he's happy i'm happy.
My 2c;
In the USA all everyone talks about is going to college (uni), it a badge that everyone wears. Total wanking. It's like which car do you drive. The pressure here is immense to do College, and to drop out is considered failure.
So, people who are tradies are therefore anyone who didn't go to uni, hence the stigma about tradies and lower IQ's etc.
It is my opinion that this same mentality still exists to a degree in Aus. The old; 'couldn't cut it at high school, so left and got a trade' mindset.
Of course, we all know that it isn't the case; it has been proven in child studies that boys learn differently from girls, and often don't stay attentive in school because the school curriculum doesn't match the thinking/learning processes of boys to a large degree. (Steve Biddulph; "Raising Boys").
Basically, boys are more 'hands-on' and practical learners, and the school curriculum is full of a lot of useless pen-pushing guff. Boys get bored and lose interest. Then they start to fail the system, and eventually drop out and do something that inspires them (trades).
So, the trades were a great alternative, or tech schools that catered to more 'hand-on' learning for specific careers such as carpentry, mechanics, plumbing, electricians, some engineering etc.
The reality is those same boys (and girls) have the same IQ as anyone else, but because of how the school curriculum is structured, they didn't fit the system and dropped out.
So, the IQ is not the issue with the tradies; they are usually very knowledgable and capable in their field of work.
If anything, it is their lack of professionalism and ability to run a professional, efficient business that has the customer service factor that everyone gets angry about. This is ultimately what brings down their image in the eyes of the paying public. And people have a hard time paying lots of money to people who are disorganised, unreliable etc etc.
Perception is the key.
This is not their fault either; as far as I know, there is no training in the trades in how to run a business, how to be a manager of people, how to serve the customer, how to manage finances and administrative duties.
Nearly all their training comes from similar bosses with the same lack of business skills. What hope do these guys have?
My two brother-in-laws are classic examples. Both dropped out at year 10. One is a sparky, one a plumber, and both are great guys and perfectionists in their work, but both are hopeless businessmen and terribly unreliable (experience). They still do well because they are basically honest and do good work for a good price.
They have both been through about 20 bosses each, mainly due to work ethic issues and being ripped off in hours and money owed before they finally started up on their own.
At the end of the day you are stuck with it , move on, build a bridge. (if your qualified to)
i am a tradie (self employed) ,i went to private school and i would make more money if i were employed most years.
i dont know many tradies with fancy cars and i dont know many tradies with kids at private schools. i remember at school one dad who owns Middy's and another guy who's dad was a plumber. Apart from that all the other kids dad's where professionals.
so you can choose to do the work yourselves, and run the risk of getting caught or killing someone, maybe a family member or maybe get a tradie who has had training in that field.
just takes a building report to ask the question ' where's the compliance certificate for that? ' that means buy buy prospective buyer and it could prolong the sale the house and the interest bills keep coming .
At the house i live in now some idiot watched a reno show and decided to extend his house, i have roof leaks where the tiles meet the clip lock , the corrugated sheets on the verandah run both ways so water leaks everywhere , wires un-clipped all through the roof and pvc water mains, i purchased the place cheaper of course. so in the end he tried to cut corners and lost , he should have got a tradie.
its your choice..
Another thing to remember is that more and more appliances void there warranty when there is no certificate these days.
People reading these forums may have lost people to such an event and you laugh about that? thats pretty lame
if you are one of those people that complains all the time, then you are just one of those people and there really isn't anything that will change that.
Find somewhere else to vent.
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