- Originally posted by kay henry:
I see shares, though, as a lot like putting money on a horse.
That’s a dangerous anaology to make because it’s untrue.
You shape your own thinking and create fear & apprehension for yourself by creating that kind of comparison.
The key to success in any form of enterprise is to start with an open mind.
Don’t limit yourself with preconceptions. Look at the facts objectively and make a decision.
BTW: I’ve never seen an ‘ethical’ share. Does it look different from a normal share? [biggrin]
Ethical companies yes – they’ve been around for 40+ years. However the measures used to judge ethicalness are not very well-reasoned.
There’s been a new wave in the last 5 years of shareholders buying into companies & making them ethical. That seems to be working quite well in the US and Europe.
Remember, if you’re not in the game you don’t get to make the rules.
Shares are as safe as houses if you go in with an open mind, do your research & select good companies – based on their management & approach. And you can call the CEOs or executive management of listed companies, you just need to pick the smaller caps who are more approachable.
Cheers,
Aceyducey
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice, there is.– Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut
acey said
‘The key to success in any form of enterprise is to start with an open mind.’ not true – you can have success with a closed mind – be careful of generalisations
‘Don’t limit yourself with preconceptions. Look at the facts objectively and make a decision’. investment is subjective as much as objective. life is full of preconceptions. pretending otherwise is ignorant
BTW: I’ve never seen an ‘ethical’ share. Does it look different from a normal share? have you seen a normal share?? nonsensical statement.
Ethical companies yes – they’ve been around for 40+ years. However the measures used to judge ethicalness are not very well-reasoned. 40 + years – really. what was the first ethical company acey?? measured use to judge normal shares are not very well reasoned, just ask enron and their auditors..
Remember, if you’re not in the game you don’t get to make the rules’. the machine makes the rules…believing we do is called narcissism
‘Shares are as safe as houses if you go in with an open mind, do your research & select good companies – based on their management & approach. And you can call the CEOs or executive management of listed companies, you just need to pick the smaller caps who are more approachable’.
shares are as safe as houses eh?? good to see you know the benchmark..
a little less arrogance in your replies would be appreciated.
Here’s the article on ethical shares:
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,10305259%255E462,00.html
kay henry
Hi Aussie,
I understand your points, as I do Acey’s, however I am unqualified in shares “ethical” or otherwise to make any real contribution re their value.
On the note of “arrogance” however, I am MORE than adequately qualified as many of my posts have been contrary to many “softer” approaches adopted in here. I don’t think Acey is trying to put anyone down in his post, rather seek clarification, but perhaps you misread it as negative.
May I be so bold, as to replace “arrogance” with “passion” and then you will see what I mean. I LOVE PROPERTY investing, and all too often my stance on it, especially to those who do not know me, is perceived as “arrogance” which is sad really, because all I want to do is share my knowledge in the hope that they will benefit.
I respect Acey’s views, as I do that of many others in here, however sometimes “putting it sweetly” or with less passion, will not convey it’s proper intention, hence be of little value.
Respectfully,
Jo
jo – its the more than slightly belittling tone with wch its delivered. its the mark of a self made man and i recognize it in myself sometimes – but its an ugly mark
I understand what you’re saying Aussie, but perhaps it’s more the fault of this type of communication medium, rather than its author??? [blink]
Anyway, I am not out to dispute anyone’s intent, it was just how I read it – as seeking clarification.Cheers,
Jo
Hi all
Shares are as safe as houses if you go in with an open mind, do your research & select good companies – based on their management & approach. And you can call the CEOs or executive management of listed companies, you just need to pick the smaller caps who are more approachable.Sorry acey whatever happened to HIH, AMP, NAB, onetel, Air New Zealand, Pasminco, Harris scarfe, Not to mention all those ones in the States. Nope you can have all the info in the world and still not pick them. As far as the small caps go the list would be even bigger. Not too many homes i’ve bought are worth $0 today, in fact none of them. Actually all of them are worth more than i paid for them, wish picking stocks was so easy.
regards westan
I live in New Zealand and for a fee find cash positive deals there, email me at [email protected] to join our database
I think it’s also about choices. I’ve had an interest in straight economics before my interest in political economy. I *choose* not to invest in shares- not due to fear etc. If I wanted to invest, I’d learn more about the nuance of them, but it’s just not an interest. Property will always be an interest.
I’m more interested in how I make the buck than in merely making the buck. Not everyone has the same goal of wealth. I’m pretty zen about money [goatee] and CG is, to me, a bonus, but not my sole aim. I’ve always had a relaxed approach to money- there’s so much more to life.
kay henry
Hi All
I have read this thread with interest. The only point I would like to make is that the examples given with shares like HIH etc give people the impression that shares go from their high to $0 in one day. This just isnt true if you look at their share charts they have been going downhill for a while sometimes for years. They normally give quite alot of warning that everything isnt ok. To give an analogy with a house imagine having termites and ignoring the inspection reports and your house falls down oneday ( yes I know you are going to say what about the land) but now you have to rebuild.
To choose the right share to invest in probably takes less time than finding the right property, Yes there are risks involved in shares but like property you learn how to minimise them, Property you need insuraance and inspections with shares you can have guranteed stop loss points.
ErikaOriginally posted by Erika:Hi All
with shares you can have guranteed stop loss points.
ErikaWhere do I find one of those? Are you talking CFD’s or ordinary shares?
With ordinary shares, there is no stop loss which will save you from a big gap or delisting.
Originally posted by aussierogue:a little less arrogance in your replies would be appreciated.Aussierogue,
The arrogance is your interpretation of my position, it’s not my position – and IMHO everyone is self-made
My posts are to shake people’s worldviews a little & make them think.
Some people need a gentle guidance, some people need to be confronted, unfortunately you can’t please all the people all the time
I do believe it’s important for people to recognise their own prejudices & biases and surmount them & I’ve mentored people in business who’ve had amazing success after achieving that.
I believe that everyone can do anything they want – the only limitation most people fail to overcome is their own belief in their limitations.
Feel free to disagree & nitpick – it’s the disagreements that makes us all learn more!
Cheers,
Aceyducey
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice, there is.– Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut
Hi
Yes I am talking CFD,s.
I couldnt agree more with aceyducey, people are limited by themselves. Most of what we do in life involves some kind of risk what we should try to do is minimise that risk not avoid it.
Erikaaceyducey –
qte
My posts are to shake people’s worldviews a little & make them think.Some people need a gentle guidance, some people need to be confronted, unfortunately you can’t please all the people all the time
unqteeven if you do say so yourself!!! please….
making money and educating people is also about communication and some of your rep;lies and comments to people have been off the cuff, off the mark, reactionary and a little flippant.
(amongst heaps of good stuff i must say. you are def one of the most knowledgeable people on the forum)learn some humility and it will help.
the most passionate people who convey great messages know how to communicate without marginalising the readers/listners. you can choose to be a in your face hard man of investing philosophy (tell it like it is, tough love kind of guy) but i dont know too many of them who hang around for too long…
dont let your ego get in the way of the message
rgds
Aussie, I’m shocked….shocked2] I nearly fell off my seat when I read your post….I’ve NEVER known you to bite at ANYONE!!!!!
You feeling okay hon??? [tongue]
Jo
aint to proud to bite…keep rockin..
I read this topic with interest.
Property Vs Shares
Property Vs Shares&Property
Positive Gearing Vs Negative Gearing
B&H Vs B&STechnical Analysis Vs Fundamental Analysis
Traders Vs InvestorsWhat else?
Kind regards
Jet Dollars
Retire Young, Retire Rich . . . REALLY? . . . I didn’t know that!Yes Jet this one has been all over the place, i’m still wanting to reply to erika’s post about 3 pages ago[confused2], by the time i do she will have forgotton what the conversation was. Oh well its all fun.
Lets reply now. Erika its not true that there is always warning that things are going bad. It happens all the time that a stock makes a shock announcement and suddenly it is worth half the value overnight HIH is the example you picked it is a classic it lost 50% in one day. As far as being smart enoughto see it comming come on , i’m sure you have lost a packet on some shares like myself and every other share trader i ‘ve ever met. If Gerry Harvey with all his billions didn’t see HIH comming (he lost millions on it)how can they average investor.
Would it help if i prepared a list of stocks that lost over 50% overnight.
regards westanI live in New Zealand and for a fee find cash positive deals there, email me at [email protected] to join our database
Hi Westan
I am not saying that shares dont drop 50% in one day but if you look at most charts they have normally gone into a down or sideways trend before they do. As I havent got the hih Chart have a look at leightons chart it droppped 25% in one day but it had given you a warning that things wernt right 8 weeks prior when it crossed below its 30w ma , yes I have lost money and when I look back at the chart I have learned that the signals were there. Gerry Harvey is a very successful business man but that doesnt mean he is a good sharetrader.
Lets have a good example if you had put your $10000 in caltex in may last year it would be worth 4.5 times more or $45000.<<<Lets have a good example if you had put your $10000 in caltex in may last year it would be worth 4.5 times more or $45000>>>
Did you buy caltex in may last yr? Probably Not. So Caltex is one stock out of 10,000 stocks or whatever it is. But a trader would have bought and sold before they received the 4.5 times return.
Originally posted by yack:<<<Lets have a good example if you had put your $10000 in caltex in may last year it would be worth 4.5 times more or $45000>>>
Did you buy caltex in may last yr? Probably Not. So Caltex is one stock out of 10,000 stocks or whatever it is. But a trader would have bought and sold before they received the 4.5 times return.
Not necessarily Yack. Some of the folk over at reefcap.com did buy it last year and are still holding.
I don’t see why you feel the need to justify your investing desicions by critisizing other folks methods. Just let them be. I’m more than happy being a trader, and I’m more than happy that you have done well with property.
Each has their day in the sun!
Cheers
You must be logged in to reply to this topic. If you don't have an account, you can register here.
