i was speaking to my mother about my future in property and she wouldnt have a bar of what i had to say.
my goal was to finish year twelve and have saved up money for my first investment property and then buy it and continue from there without going to uni.
but my mother just repeatedly said “these days you CANT just do this property investing in fact you cant get anywhere without going to university and getting certificates for different things”
my case is exactly like the story “rich dad poor dad” and all i want to know is what is wrong wiith my ideas and has my mother been misinformed or is it i who am being too naive?
cheers, brady[hair2]
I think both of you are have valid points, however also a little uninformed.
Firstly, I admire your direction and determination for having your eye on your goal. Especially, after copping some flack on this site.
I think everyone here wish they had started as young as you (even if it is gaining knowledge and not doing the practical side yet)Now, As for saving for your IP after grade 12, great! However, what are you going to do, while the equity grows for you to purchase the next one?
It’s not a full time job to look after one IP!
If you are going to keep saving for the deposit on your next IP, where are you getting the money from? Work at Woolies or Mac Donalds?
Why not go to Uni, work part-time and save. Why not study something related to property investment. There are many fields – you could be an accountant, architect, developer, valuer etc..What I’m trying to say is;
You could work in the industry and not go to uni, while investing, For Example; Real estate agent. However the point is, the professions mentioned above, by going to Uni, in the end,you will be earning a lot more money, than not going to UNI. Making your investment portfolio increase with ease.I think your Mum just wants the best for you.
Just make sure you go into a field that you are passionate about, and the field is going to produce the income you desire to live the lifestyle you want.Why not do both??? It’s not that hard…
Apparently a degree means it’s easier to raise money from private investors. Also Uni means you don’t have to work (full time) for a minimum of 3yrs.; you can get loans where you don’t have to pay any interest off until you have left uni and banks don’t mind lending to uni students – they see a big pay check comming up when you leave uni and get a full time job.
So go to uni and become a property investor.
Also it shouldn’t be that hard to get to uni if you enjoy business studies and economics (which are rather useful for investing).
Rgds.
Lucifer_auHey there lil_man,
In answer to both your PM and your post, let me commend you on your enthusiasm.[biggrin]
Don’t be too harsh in thinking your mum is not understanding you, trust me, as a mother myself, I am sure she does (far more than you give her credit for). She wants what is best for you, and right now, that is you putting every bit of effort into your studies; and she’s right, those certificates and things, will aid you in getting where you want to go.
Patience is always difficult to comprehend at your age (and mine too, sometimes!!!!) but it is necessary, and the strength it takes to wait, can be quite character building!!!
Take heart, read lots, study hard, save your pennies, and one day, you will make mince meat out of some of us in here (who will be quite old and grey by then!!!!)[blush2]
Be good to your mum, she loves you!!![inlove]
Jo
Hi Brady,
I think it is great for you to have such goals at your age, however you will most likely change your mind several times over the coming years as to what you want to do in life. A good education is very important as the skills and knowledge obtained can be very beneficial, especially if you want to pursue a career in property investing.Your Mother is not misinformed, she is most likely doing what Mothers do best and that is caring for the welfare of her children and trying to steer you in the right direction, you must remember she was born in a different era than you and this is probably the way she was bought up.Don’t put yourself down by thinking you are naive, as i said you are still very young and have your whole life in front of you, Maybe you could gather as much information on property investing as you can and sit down with your Mother and talk to her about it. Hope i have been helpful.
FostonLife is a series of new beginnings
Hey lil man,
I too, had it drilled into me that university is an absolute MUST and I would be disowned from the family if I didn’t go! So I went, and ultimately it paid off!
Mum is right in saying that you really should have a degree these days, you can still get by without one, and sometimes quite well, but a degree is something to fall back on, and she has your best interests at heart. Trust me you will NEVER be able to convince her otherwise because she is your MOTHER (that is all she needs to be to be right) !!! You know what lil man, it is hard being young as nobody takes you seriously, but to gain your mothers respect for your ideas, you must show respect for hers also, and your friendship can grow from there.
As for property investing GOOD ON YOU!!! So much drive so young – well done [
]Still, go to uni though, its good fun!! You may want to have 20 properties, but you still need something to do with your life for satisfaction! Perhaps you can study business and open up a real estate with such a budding passion for property??
Best wishes to you young man!
Liz
Mortgage Lender
Firstly you will need to select subjects that will need to still provide you with the ability to go back to uni if you indeed don’t go to uni straight after high school.
Say to your mother (for example) that you need a year between high school and a possible uni course to see if you can in fact make it without a degree… many flitter this time on overseas travel or partying but as long as you maintain your focus I am sure you won’t necessarily do those things.
One thing I must say is avoid the ‘demon’ drink. Apart from often clouding your judgement booze also costs a fair amount. Remembering back to my army days in the early 90s there were times when barrack mates would head off and spend hundreds of dollars on a night they couldn’t even remember (but it must’ve been good?[sick3] ). This and having to have the latest of things, drugs and so on is attributed to ‘peer pressure’ which is very relevant at your age. I’m not saying you can’t have a good time, just that these, in my opinion, are far from attributing to a good time that could sustain itself.
A couple of lesser things, learn how to cook, I’m not saying become one but in this day and age most people just go out and buy take away. You could prepare a better meal for far less by buying the base ingredients and being able to put a small amount of effort in.
Considering your interest in property investing and from a young age then perhaps if you do take the first year to see if you have continued interest in that path you should try job(s) in that field. Whether is be directly in the building industry or even something like cabinet making or landscaping (horticulture which can be taught at uni as well… sort of covers a couple of bases). Part-time work prior to leaving school will probably help you save the money needed to get started, though the banks may not be interested until you have had a job for a decent amount of time.
I do admire your enthusiasm, just remember if you go to uni FINISH it, the piece of paper seems more important than what you have learnt and only going a couple of years into a degree and not completing only leaves you with a large bill.
Assuming that your post is fairdinkum Lil_man
(which I doubt) let me say this :Miracle puts the case very well when he said :
“by going to Uni, in the end,you will be earning a lot more money, than not going to UNI. Making your investment portfolio increase with ease.”.
Anyone who suggest otherwise is a fool.
Anyway, you have some years to go before the time comes for you to decide whether to continue your studies or not.
In the meantime please realise that it will be to your advantage, for the rest of your life if, right now, you take your present studies very serious by trying to be the best in your class.
Acquiring good study habits will sow qualities in you which will stand you in good stead for the rest of your life.
Pisces
I didn’t go to university. But now that my wife is going to university and I am hanging out with the uni crowd and also dropping her in each morning I have one very very good reason why you should go and also why I wish to hell I had of gone when I was 18.
University is full of beautiful smart girls…
Simon Macks
Mortgage Broker
http://www.mortgagehunter.com.au
0425 228 985Comments may not be relevant to individual circumstances. If you intend making any investment, financial or taxation decision you should consult a professional adviser.
Originally posted by Pisces:Assuming that your post is fairdinkum Lil_man
(which I doubt) let me say this :Miracle puts the case very well when he said :
“by going to Uni, in the end,you will be earning a lot more money, than not going to UNI. Making your investment portfolio increase with ease.”.
Anyone who suggest otherwise is a fool.
Many situations that logic breaks down. I’ll even give a ‘real life’ example:
There are generally two basic ways to become an officer in the military. Person A would be to go to the normal officer school (say Duntroon in this case, Canberra) spend 18 months going through officer training and graduate a Lt and from that point the promotion ladder starts (or in reality 6 months after that when they graduate their specific Corps training). Under regulations though you cannot progress beyond Major unless you have a degree (doesn’t really matter in what), instead Person B goes to ADFA (Australian Defence Force Academy) spends 4 years on fairly light pay to finally graduate a Lt and then they start their promotion system. There is very little stopping officers from doing part-time courses so why spend an extra 2 1/2 years doing a course to get to the same position? If Person A finds that the military wasn’t what he wanted or the public sector wanted him for his leadership skills then I would think the uni degree at that point would be almost useless, there would again be nothing stopping Person A from later obtaining a degree that is more valid.
Also remember that Person A was earning decent money a full 2 1/2 years earlier than Person B and would always be more senior in ‘service time’ than the other.
A comment I like is:
They never teach common sense 101 at uni.
For the record I did go to uni for a time as well…..
Originally posted by iamborediambored:Originally posted by miracle:by going to Uni, in the end,you will be earning a lot more money, than not going to UNI. Making your investment portfolio increase with ease.
Rubbish!!! I earn a lot more than most of my mates and didn’t need any qualification whatsoever. Uni teaches you the theory. Life teaches you the practical. How does going to uni increase your portfolio?
For those that don’t think having a uni degree means squat take a look at the income of people with uni degrees vrs people who don’t. The ones with a uni degree have a higher avarage wage. In fact when you take the mean income it’s even higher. So in fact having a degree will more than likly mean you will recieve higher wages than someone who didn’t go to uni.
Originally posted by iamborediambored:
Also, I have never heard a more incorrect statement then lenders love lending money to uni students because they see a big pay-off. How do they service a debt if they are studying full-time???Since you have never tried to get a loan while at uni – May I ask you what backs up your thinking? Because while at uni I was very easily able to get a mortgage for an IP. O’h and though uni might be considered ‘full time’ it isn’t difficult to have a part time job (hell, some studnets manage to clock up 40hrs at a job every week).
Look banks like to see a story that is succesful. So they see, here is a student with a part time job going to uni, when he leaves he will have a higher income (on avarage) than someone witout a degree. Usually people with degrees (like Doctors, etc) like buying big ticket items and big houses for themselves, which means more money for banks like us. That is why they don’t mind lending money to students (where as joe blow avarage would!) and why they do not like lending to people on a pension.
While of course they don’t lend on the idea, if your fundamentals (income, job, etc) are good they will lend you the money.
Rgds.
Lucifer_auOriginally posted by MortgageHunter:University is full of beautiful smart girls…
And lots of them – provided you don’t study engineering! [grad]
GP
ex-engineering studentLil_Man / Brady,
Try to remember that to get ahead in life (smoothly) you need to participate in two types of schools
1. The school of textbooks and teachers
2. The school of life (which comes from experiencing everyday things, such as joys, sadnesses, victories and defeats)Of the two, the latter will come about through the natural progression of time, and is inevitable. But the first, is by choice, and in choosing to go that extra mile (university) you will increase your chances for a greater head start.
Take it from someone who has done both; I went to uni and got my PhD as well as having become a successful (well in my books anyway) investor. You can achieve anything if you put your mind to it, and every little bit of effort will evenutally pay off.
Keep up the good work,
Jo
BTW……just on a final note, having gone to uni and getting my doctorate didn’t necessarily mean I ended up with a huge pay packet,quite the reverse actually, university is not cheap!!!!
Study hard, but please, SAVE, SAVE, SAVE….for both your schooling and your investing dreams.
Jo
Now considering that Doctor started study after 1997 then he would be paying Hecs on something akin to 40-50k debt already. Of course this only increases about 3% per year and there is a 13% (?) bonus for paying the debt out early but it is something that has to be calculated to ‘true’ income. Possible a net income would be the best for the argument rather than the amount given from ‘gross’.
Of course becoming a doctor then means Lil_man would totally miss his goals which were to be able move to property investing pretty much all the time.
Lets look at an example of wage earner from 17 compared to the uni student from 17:
WE 18: started work after a period of looking, wage is cruddy but living with parents and got their first car. If person doesn’t drink it all can still save heaps.
US 18: started uni, unless supported by parents and on Austudy would have to take a part-time job to survive. Not much hope of saving money. Plus work interferes with study and could affect results (catch 22). Incurs a debt (HECs).
WE 19: Continues earning income, depending on job payrises could follow (example would be an apprenticeship). Good opportunity to save more.
US 19: First year was a breeze compared to second year, quite often courses rehash what was learned through high school in the first year. Person may need to put more time into studying and researching papers. HECs debt increases at least twice now.
WE 20: Possibly enough money for one or more investment, either PPOR or IP. Again chance for serious wage increase, though usually still well below the mean of the country.
US 20: Third year and time to cram, cram, cram. HECs debt builds and you still need part-time work to pay the bills, especially if you have to study away from home.
WE 21: This is the year that apprentices quite often become tradesmen I think. If that is the case serious wage increase and employment opportunities do increase. If IP or PPOR previous year they have the opportunity to look at another IP or paying down the debt they have.
US 21: Find out most uni degrees mean nothing without experience. Look for work and get some initially underpaid job (compared to the mean). Potential is there but the WE already has his fingers in the pie as far as investing in property (Which afterall was Lil_man’s objective).
I think the big difference early on would be if the wage Earner failed to be responsible with their money. Few people are at that age, then again I have known plenty of uni students that weren’t either….
Brady,
It is great to see someone so young with such vision. Having said this don’t forget to be young. I have spent the last 5.5 years at Uni and am approaching finishing my Masters at age 23. I realised that studying is only part of the university lifestyle, an equally great part is having fun, chasing tail and making lifelong friends. You don’t want to be a 58 year old property barron who hasn’t had any life experience aside from property and regrets not making more of their youth. So finish school, go to uni, run amok and do the things you will regret not having done otherwise. There is no reason – as some of the above posts have mentioned above – why you can’t do all of this, work, study and invest. Take it first hand, as I said I am 23 and I am also very driven but if I had my time over I wouldn’t change a thing. No amount of property can replace youthful experiences, it is something you jsut can’t put a price tag on.
Apples.
Why not teach your Mum about real estate at the same time? Maybe you could convince her to become a property guru too?
I did one year of Uni – that was 9 years ago, straight out of secondary school. I regret two things – 1 – obviously not finishing what I started, and 2 – not taking a year off in between finishing secondary school and starting uni.
Do what has been suggested. Finish school, take a year off and work in some sort of industry related to real estate ( I suggest those that enable you to do your own handyman stuff ), then go back to Uni and study something that you think will help you in the real estate game.
Of course all of this is reliant on you keeping the enthusiasm going for realestate.
Cheers
“Looking forward to the day when I can tell the boss where to go”
There are many ways to achieve your end goal. Keep this in mind and be flexible about the journey that takes you there. Personally I need to remind myself of this on a regular basis and it saves me a lot of stress.
I see university as an insurance policy. If you need to work for an income then it is usually quicker and easier to get a higher paying job if you have a degree. Most universities let you defer for at least a year either before starting your course or during it. Part time study might also suit you. There are also many positions for degree qualified people to work part time – again on a higher hourly rate than positions generally available to people without qualifications.
Also, the higher your income, the quicker you can start saving and investing in whatever you choose. While there are high income earners who do not have a university education, these people are, statistically, a minority. Do your due dillegence and check it out for yourself with the Australian Bureau of Statistics.
Another thing to be aware of is that there are plenty of well educated drop-outs. University alone will not be the deciding factor when it comes to achieving your goals.
Regerds
Sonjaiamborediambored
“This is an average. Has Kerry Packer got a degree? For those who don’t know, he is the richest man in Australia and started by delivering newspapers.”Unfortunately not everyone can inherit a publishing empire started by his father (and by the way Kerry Packer wasn’t the first in line to manage the empire – Clyde Packer was, but he didn’t have an interest in running it or even being in Australia – of course his sons are in PBL and went to US universities). Or have their family invest in their business (Bill Gates father who helped seed MS was actually a very succesful IP lawyer and Bill Gates did go to Uni he just dropped out, Warren Buffet who runs Berkshire Hathaway has a masters degree and actually leanred how to invest from one of his professors -Ben Graham. Also many on the ‘Rich List’ by Forbes are Princes from Saudi Arabia that have university degrees. How about Sam Walton the guy who started Walmart (his offspring take up 3 places in Forbes Rich List and while he was alive he was the 2nd richest man after Bill Gates) had a university degree.
I’m not saying that just because you might or might not go to Uni you will become a billionaire. All I’m saying is that on average (and since that is probably the only thing we can base this on) the people with Uni degrees can earn more money than someone without a degree. Also when you go to Uni you get to meet up with some incredible smart people (whom do you think Bill gates hired when he start up MS???).
Rgds.
Lucifer_auOriginally posted by sizzling_duck:
There are generally two basic ways to become an officer in the military. Person A would be to go to the normal officer school (say Duntroon in this case, Canberra) spend 18 months going through officer training and graduate a Lt and from that point the promotion ladder starts (or in reality 6 months after that when they graduate their specific Corps training). Under regulations though you cannot progress beyond Major unless you have a degree (doesn’t really matter in what), instead Person B goes to ADFA (Australian Defence Force Academy) spends 4 years on fairly light pay to finally graduate a Lt and then they start their promotion system. There is very little stopping officers from doing part-time courses so why spend an extra 2 1/2 years doing a course to get to the same position? If Person A finds that the military wasn’t what he wanted or the public sector wanted him for his leadership skills then I would think the uni degree at that point would be almost useless, there would again be nothing stopping Person A from later obtaining a degree that is more valid.Also remember that Person A was earning decent money a full 2 1/2 years earlier than Person B and would always be more senior in ‘service time’ than the other.
A comment I like is:
They never teach common sense 101 at uni.
For the record I did go to uni for a time as well…..
Having worked in Navy Officer Promotions (zact same ‘timeframes’ as Army) I’ll tell you that it takes 6 years from entrance as an officer to become a Captain – NO MATTER which way you first joined up. So if A joined RMC on the same day that B joined ADFA, their seniority is exactly the same. In truth, I think they differ by a couple of weeks, but by the time they make Captain, it will be 01 Jan 200?…
From memory (this was a few years ago) ADFA ‘students’ earned something like $12-14K per year, which is not bad considering your food, clothes, lodging etc. are included…. Oh yeah, plus a free degree!!
Even if you go to ADFA for 2 years, and drop out just before graduation day of 2nd year, you don’t have to pay back any money, or any time spent to the military – you don’t think many of them know about this?
Also from memory, an RMC guy/gal would be paid about $19K to start with, but would be working their butts off anyway, and still ‘studying’ as well. Then, as you’ve said, if they want to make it much further in their careers (if they choose to) they have to get a degree anyway – more than likely on their own time……
Cheers
Mel
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