afloat, fabulous!
re: “What ever happened to buying in an area you know v.well “
If I limited myself to that (i.e. London, Sydney, Melbourne, Auckland, wellington, LA) I simply wouldn’t be in the market now! I just made it my business to get to know other areas which had properties which fit my investment criteria.
Have you heard of ‘who moved my cheese’? it’s about a bunch of mice who react differently to the fact that one day the cheese that had always been there had gone. Some went to find more…others stayed there and waited, wingeing about it….you get the picture.
The property cheese may not be where you live, (depending where that is.) And as a property investor, if the cheese has moved, and you don’t move, you end up like the mice in the book who didn’t respond to change….read it to find out what happened to them.!
OK another example – a friend of mine was a grain trader a year or so ago. Fancy boutique offices, Sydney beachfront residence. Negatively geared properties up the wazoo. Then the drought happened. Bugger all grain to trade. His cheese moved. He was unable or unwilling to change – (learn to trade something else? etc) so…..
the business went under, very very fast. no more beachfront residence either. now he’s delivering take-aways. but you know what? he looks happier than I’ve ever known him, rather than stressed. He seems less arrogant and more chilled too.joy to the world
Hum Mini, sorry to saythis but the moral of the traders story is …?
Success = stress and arrogance,
Pizza dude = happiness and relaxation?
[confused2]May God prosper you always.[biggrin]
Marcmarc – yeah, and in the end trading is a job – you don’t trade, you don’t get paid.
joy to the world
Monopoly,
You said you had been badly burned buying interstate. was that a two-tier marketed place?
Also, whilst investing in one’s backyard (or State) has its advantages, a LOT of nsw investors will be looking elsewhere to buy than in nsw due to the introduction of the exit duty. Generally, I think people will invest where it might seem tax advantageous or efficient (hence one of the reasons for such great interest in IP’s in NZ).
If you’ve done research and have a good PM, I think it takes out *much* of the risk, but it still is a bit of a feeling of the unknown buying in places completely out of ones’ field of knowledge.
Buying in Japan or the US of england- personally, I’d be a complete chicken about it. But then, I’m pretty conservative and not much of a risk-taker.
kay henry
Hi Kay,
No nothing like that, I got burnt by PPM – Poor Property Management, not once but several times. There was a great deal of “oh you’re from Melbourne…hmmmmm???” (not actually voiced) type of attitude. Researched PMs from different RE agencies, asked locals, friends & family for recommendations and (just bad luck really) couldn’t find a PM that would actually do the job he/she was paid to do.
I know, I could’ve jumped up and down more, but I got soooooo sick of it, especially when things would go wrong constantly. I’d authorise repairs/maintenance to be carried out and then if and/when I’d fly out to do a personal inspection, I’d find that the work had not been done (yet the money had been deducted from the rent)!!!! I have been in more legal disputes because of PMs (not tenants so much) than I care to mention!!! In the end, I got so fed up, I sold the IPs, and decided to stick with my own home state….that way, at very worst, I could do the managing myself, without having to rely on incompetent and/or deceitful agents.
I would never discourage anyone from investing interstate or overseas; although I urge them to be cautious and diligent in the choices they make and the people they appoint as PMs. Possibly one day, when the bitter taste has subsided, I MAY reconsider, but for now…..I will keep my IPs close; where I can SEE first hand what is going on.
I don’t mind risk, but after past experiences, I am more in favour of having total control; thus minimising the risks!!!
Jo
Hi Minmogul
re: “What ever happened to buying in an area you know v.well “
If I limited myself to that (i.e. London, Sydney, Melbourne, Auckland, wellington, LA) I simply wouldn’t be in the market now! I just made it my business to get to know other areas which had properties which fit my investment criteria.
Totally agree, if you make your business – however, not many +ve geared properties in any populated area. Sub million pop is regional.
As my post implied, my hard earnt dollars stay in postcodes i can walk to, because a.) I can afford it, b.)I maintain control within feasible means, and c.)if its not metro, or metro with water views – or within ‘easy’ commute to above – what does it have?T
hats what I have identified as best for my circumstances, having lived and worked in rural/regional Aus, and as an active purchaser, I have no confidence in non metro regions to perform long or even medium term.
Have you heard of ‘who moved my cheese’? it’s about a bunch of mice who react differently to the fact that one day the cheese that had always been there had gone. Some went to find more…others stayed there and waited, wingeing about it….you get the picture.
Of course, read it….blah blah blah……..same self help book different title.
My observation is that if so many investors have in the past been so effectively enticed into Gold Coast 2 tier markets, then how many can be separated from their cash and equity by not conducting sufficient due dilligence into investment properties in regions or countries with base economies in primary industry, cottage industry or tourism. Off course they are cheap!!.
cheers
brahms
If you don’t ask, the answer is no!!
Duh, noone said they weren’t cheap brahms, but even people who live in countries with cottage industry and tourism ‘dependency’ (word used lightly) need to live somewhere, and yep, they even rent houses.
I may be missing the point, but I get the sense that you are dissing on the strategies that some of us are using to build our portfolios (if I am wrong, sorry, but the sense of your thread hints at that)
Monopoly, even investing in your own town can have bad results with RE Management. I have a place bayside Brisvegas – I didn’t even get a chance to sack the PM, her agency sacked her before I got to sack them. She was shocking. And yes it was a little easier to deal with, but not that much.
Brahms “of course read it ….. blah blah blah ….” glad you are so up with everything. Wish I was that smart and happening (slight hint of sarcasm here, similar to what I sensed in your reply to Mini)
That’s my two cents worth….. if you don’t like cash flow positive investing – fine, but don’t diss us on a cashflow positive forum!!!!!
CD
CastleDreamer
Originally posted by CastleDreamer:Monopoly, even investing in your own town can have bad results with RE Management. I have a place bayside Brisvegas – I didn’t even get a chance to sack the PM, her agency sacked her before I got to sack them. She was shocking. And yes it was a little easier to deal with, but not that much.
Absolutely CastleDreamer,
No arguments from me on that score………I am by no means suggesting the just because one’s IPs are in their own backyard, that they will not encounter PM woes. For me, being able to actually drive down to the IP and MAKE SURE the maintenance work that I paid to have done, was indeed DONE put mind my at ease. Mine is just a case of bad experience leaving a “bitter taste”, and (who knows) in time, I may re-consider interstate property investing again. But for now…..home is where my $$$ is, and will remain.
Cheers,
Jo
Quote:Originally posted by Motivstorm:lizzy, 150 per week rental for a 90,000 house isn’t exactly fitting the 11 seconds rule? unless there’s some creativity put into the deal?
Hi Motivstorm… Sorry for my ignorance, I am not completely familiar with Steves work but this refers to the purchase price of the property being derived as a funtion of the projected rental…
I must admit i’m slightly skeptical that this should be a hard and fast rule of property investment. A keen eye for capital growth areas coupled with a property creating passive income from day one gets me interested. Thus far I am a supporter of Steves work in general.
Still – each to their own.
Liz Wilson
Mortgage Lender
Originally posted by The Mortgage Adviser:Investors should diversify.
If someone gave me 50c (not even a dollar) for every time a financial advisor gave me that tip; I wouldn’t have had to invest in a thing!!! Yes I understand it, but do I WANT TO???? No….and if that is my downfall, so be it………$1.5 (almost 2) million of NET value, and without the need for “diversification”. AS I SAID…..I have invested in interstate properties, shares and managed funds…..and the ONLY thing that produced real results was property (but it was not a FAST gain, it took many years) and that’s okay….I can afford to be patient, especially with that kind of “debt free” asset base.If you had diversified and bought some interstate properties, the losses you encountered in NSW may be made back by increasing prices in your holdings interstate.
As I said (above) I did invest interstate, but it was not NSW….my interstate IPs were in QLD.It takes a little time to sell an IP.
No shit??????? I have never had too much of a problem, and have never been in a “hurry” to sell quickly….just as well hey????You have to sit back and watch your investments erode away chasing a decent price.
Erode away??????? I’ll take my chances, but as I owe NOTHING on them; I think I’ll manage okay.Are you still happy buying near where you live Jo?
Yes thanks Rob; it works for me!!!Thanks for the tips Rob, but you are preaching to the converted. You may think me foolish, and that is fine, you are entitled to your opinion. But I have successfully managed to build a healthy level of wealth without anyone’s help since I was 17. How many people do you know that can say the same????
Jo
Kiyosaki said diversify so often means ‘deworsify’ – people have to rush around doing all sorts of investments because nothing is doing particularly well.
monopoly, like you I owe nothing on my investments but I am about to start (gently) gearing – number four property will mean rents from 4 properties cover repayments on one. Property 5 will mean that rents from five cover repayments on two…6, rents from 6 props will cover repayments on 3…at that stage I have doubled my portfolio and Still have 50 percent LVR. I will probably carry on down to 30 percent LVR, and feel still fairly secure, being a quite risk-averse person. So I am expecting to get about 4 more this year.
after that i’ll wait till either rents rise or properties go up in value, and then get more!joy to the world
Hhhmmmm, I seem to miss the meaty bits of this thread constantly!!!!
CDCastleDreamer
Originally posted by The Mortgage Adviser:Jo,
I wrote you a lengthy reply but the website went down and it was lost. I couldn’t be bothered to rewrite it but I will give you the short version…
TAKE A PILL AND CHILL!!!There is no reason to get your back up.
I’m sorry if you felt that I had.I have no idea what you get up to in your bedroom and would not even fathom to tell you what to do as we have never met. My goodness, what would you tell me to my face if we had??? That was a bit below the belt don’t you think???
You seem to know everything anyway. I never implied to know everything; I would never insult yours (or anyone else’s) intelligence and suggest such a thing. All I said was, that I had tried different things (i.e. interstate property investing, shares, managed funds, and the ONLY thing that produced real results was property).
I apologise for giving general commentary and putting your name on it. Won’t happen again! No need to apologise; I never took any offense to your (general) comments or otherwise. You are more than entitled to your opinion, and I always appreciate hearing yours (and others) views on different matters.
Rob,
I am not upset by anything you said, including the bit about the bedroom (I’d like to think that was just a “knee-jerk” reaction to my comments which you obviously took as insults).
I would like to apologise for ANY comment which may have offended you; I can assure you there was no malice intended toward you, or anyone else, by what I wrote.
Unfortunately that is one of the down sides of written communication, the lack of emotive expression, which consequently results in messages being misinterpreted by its readers.Jo
Originally posted by MiniMogul:Kiyosaki said diversify so often means ‘deworsify’ – people have to rush around doing all sorts of investments because nothing is doing particularly well.
monopoly, like you I owe nothing on my investments but I am about to start (gently) gearing – number four property will mean rents from 4 properties cover repayments on one. Property 5 will mean that rents from five cover repayments on two…6, rents from 6 props will cover repayments on 3…at that stage I have doubled my portfolio and Still have 50 percent LVR. I will probably carry on down to 30 percent LVR, and feel still fairly secure, being a quite risk-averse person. So I am expecting to get about 4 more this year.
after that i’ll wait till either rents rise or properties go up in value, and then get more!
joy to the worldGood for you Mini,
Keep up the good work!!!! [biggrin]
JoCastleDreamer,
I am starting to think that expressing one’s opinion on here is frought with danger!
As I have said, all too often, that problem with written communication is the severe lack of emotive expression, which of course can (and does) often reult in people getting the WRONG message, hence getting upset unnecessarily!
Cheers,
Jo
Absolutely, that’s why sometimes it is easier and probably better forum manners to let some of the interpreted barbs, slide past. They aren’t always meant to sting. Conversely, if someone is intending to stick you, ignoring them is eminently more satisfying!! Would you agree?? Stick in a few more emoticons, …. !@@$%R and stuff helps too.
Burring up, just gets others burred up, which is entertaining – I saw you check out my profile, so you would know I have been following some of the more emotive threads – but burring up detracts from the intent of the original poster sometimes. I like to think I will burr up, then return to the topic at hand to finish my post perhaps!!!!Cheers to all!!!!!!!
CDCastleDreamer
CastleDreamer,
I was checking out your profile when I was replying to Marc1 re my choice of avatar, which he suggested was “revealing”.
I was looking at yours, because I remembered you had some little creature, but couldn’t remember what exactly, so I went to have a look. When I realised it was a mouse, I decided it best to refer to an actual cartoon character, i.e. Pepe Le Pew. This was so I could say, someone with Pepe Le Pew isn’t necessarily a skunk, but I didn’t recognise who (if an actual character) your avatar was, so I decided against referring to it.
Sorry if it appeared that I was spying on your, or doing anything untorwards.
Jo
How can you tell if someone is checking your profile? Didn’t know we had that function? And people check others’ profiles all the time. Sometimes you might like what someone has to say so you check out what ELSE they’ve said elsewhere.
So how do you find out if someone’s been looking at your profile?
kay henry
the louder someone is yelling, the more fun I find them to debate with.
Anyway, moving right along. As I was saying, in China did you know that they can clone an ear on a mouse and the cash on cash return is the equivelent to the yield of,…………….
Cheers,
Gatsby.
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