I noted a post by Elves yesterday where she made a remark about someone buying a property, taking an unfair advantage of someone in trouble.
Now we have gone through all of this before more than once on this site with both Kay and Bec and myself sprouting strong opinions about the subject (though not necessarily all looking at things from the same point of view).
Seeing that (so the story goes) someone died around Easter just for the purpose of saving Mankind and that therefore this is a time of goodwill and reflection (even though in some other parts of the world many people right now don’t appear to see it quite that way) I would like to tell a thought provoking story and will let you all ponder how relevant it is to us and real estate.
In a small village lived a poor family on a couple of acres of land, eking out a bare existence with their wealth all tied up in their possessions of one cow and one horse.
One day the horse ran away and all the villagers came, one at a time, to tell the owner how sorry they felt about his loss and how unfortunate it was for this to have happened.
The old man, who was a bit of a philosopher, countered ‘Unfortunate ? I don’t really know’.
Ten days later the horse returned to its old master and in the process brought along seven or eight wild horses with it.
Again the neighbours in the village felt it necessary to congratulate the owner of the horse about his good fortune.
Again, the old man countered ‘Fortunate ? Well,
who knows whether it is or isn’t’His son started to break in the new horses and during this job he happened to fall off one of the horses and broke his leg.
Again, the neighbours all came up to the father expressing their sorrow about the accident his son had been involved in.
Again the old man countered with ‘Unfortunate accident ? Who knows whether that is or isn’t the case.’
Three weeks later the army came into the small village to force all the young men into the army for their proposed campaign against a neighbouring country.
The old man’s son however was allowed to remain behind in the village because of his broken leg.
Again the neighbours came up to the old man and said ‘How fortunate that your son missed out on being forced into the army.’
Again the old man countered and said ……..
Anyway , do I need to go on and on and on ?
The moral of the above story is of course that we don’t really know at the time whether a particular event is beneficial or adverse to one.
in my own life on several occasions things have happened which, at the time, I saw as catastrofic.
Do I need to tell you that all those events which, at the time, I labelled as ‘disaster’, in the end turned out to be a blessing in disguise ?
The same applies to someone in a financial strife.
Who are we to judge whether that is exactly what
was being planned upstairs to happen ?Seen in this light we (as a buyer) are just the instrument, a participant in the event.
Should a Kay or a Bec really prevent a buyer from being a participant in the drama of life being played out ?
Whilst I (to say the least) have serious doubt about the Jesus story I do actually like to bring it into the post.
If there hadn’t been a Judas then we (that is you, the religious mob) wouldn’t have had Jesus die and thus ‘save’ the world.
Someone had to play the part of Judas just as someone has to be the buyer of the property at a rockbottom price.
Who is to judge ?
(proverb 3:5)Pisces
I like the story, I think I’ve heard something similar a long time ago.
THe events that happened were all ‘naturally occuring’ events. Not about people doing something bad to other people.
If you take this story too far, then people could interpret it to mean that people could just do rotten things to each other because Hey at the end it might turn out to be a blessing in disguise anyway.
SO I think not only around Easter and Xmas we should show goodwill and have the best intentions, but aiming for this always!
I, like everyone else probably, also had a few terrible things happen to me.
Not every thing disasterous turned out to be a blessing in disguise. You cannot be sure that bad events will ALWAYS turn out OK.Happy Easter everyone!
Celivia, it all comes down to what is the actual situation Man is in.
Is our life pre-ordained ? Are we only puppets in a play ?
Is there order in the universe or do things happen at random ?
(Or perhaps a mixture of both ?)
Whatever we are we all are formed by our genes, our hormones and our past experiences.
It seems to me that if we were to live our life all over again we would live exactly the same life, making all the same mistakes.
We are all victims, we think that we ‘do’ things, that we are smart and because of that we may have perhaps made some money whilst it seems to me that everything that happens to one is purely ‘an accident’.
Pisces
In the words of a very wise man ……………………………………..
$#IT HAPPENS!
Its all good, its all bad, it is what you do with it that counts.
Go Philosphy
Kev[cigar]
Some people shit and say “ewwwww get rid of it”
Some see fertilizer and put it to work
[lmao]
______________________
I know I can, I know I can
We are all made from stars.dead ones actually and that’s were we are all going to end up again. You dont just get your atoms out of thin air……………….or do you?
Gee……..I should be looking for my next deal…….I only have 4.5 billion years before the sun runs out of hydrogen!
“Dont be looking in your back yard for a four leaf clover when the opportunity of a lifetime could be knocking on your front door….”
Have I logged onto lifehelp.com or propertyinvesting.com
I’ll have to log off and re enter the proper site.
aluminati.That just goes to show you what it is we are talking about Aluminati.
One moment we all are real estate experts, the next thing you know is that we suddenly are talking about life mysteries.
Pisces
well guys, someone once told me it is not the result of the action that matters but is the intention behind it.
A common scenario these days are for eg. wrappers like Otten who i believe pretends to have a good intention of helping battlers and when it sort of work ot he exclaims himself as an aussie hero. However, we at the back of our minds know that his intention was only to make himself rich and if the battlers don’t make the payments then theres hell to pay for.
So even if his resultant actions may appear to be beneficial to tese people his intentions were not.
At the end of the day we answer to our conscience and intentions and we can only leave the result of the action to predestination.
Originally posted by fjficm:At the end of the day we answer to our conscience and intentions and we can only leave the result of the action to predestination.
Exactly!!! I totally agree with what you wrote, fjficm.
as the saying goes…three things you should never talk about.
“Religion, Sex and Politics”
“If You never never ask, you’ll never never know”
I think we are diverging from the original topic
Fjficm but here goes :Fjficm, you said (talking about Otten) : ‘However, we at the back of our minds know that his intention was only to make himself rich and if the battlers don’t make the payments then there’s hell to pay for.’
Firstly, one particular kind of action (making money wrapping) can at the same time have a benefit putting people in houses.
Even if that isn’t the main motivating reason for wrapping by the wrapper (and even if that is now held out to be by the wrapper ) so what ?
Secondly you then go on to say : ‘However, we at the back of our minds know that his intention was only to make himself rich and if the battlers don’t make the payments then there’s hell to pay for.’
I just think that what you are saying there is rather illogical. Your expectations are so unreal.
Think about it. A wrapper doesn’t have virtually unlimited funds to buy properties so by necessity he needs to borrow in order to buy.
So if the wrappee defaults the wrapper has to take steps or else the whole enterprise will fall apart.
Why do you attack the wrapper and not the banks for similar behaviour ?
Are you really implying that the banks act in such a philantropic manner whilst a wrapper doesn’t ?
The banks of course don’t. They couldn’t because their money is borrowed money so they cannot give it away.
The whole thing is so silly, so unrealistic and has been discussed before on this site.
Please let us return to the topic of the first post.
Pisces
Originally posted by Pisces:If there hadn’t been a Judas then we (that is you, the religious mob) wouldn’t have had Jesus die and thus ‘save’ the world.
Hmm – so what does this mean:
1) There needs to be bad guys for there to be good guys….well maybe. If everyone was ‘good’ whatever that was, you couldn’t define it!
2) Judas should be worshipped as a Saint for showing christians the true path to god rather than cast down in ignobility.
3) There’s no such thing as free will – so what you do doesn’t matter because you’re not responsible for your actions, they’re planned by god.
Bringing this back to property – or at least investments – knowing more than the other party is a key point in many negotiations. If you know you can redevelop the land for a profit then you don’t tell the seller about this.
Is this unfair advantage? Not if the seller can find out the same info but doesn’t bother.
Cheers,
Aceyducey
pisces
don’t be angry its just my opinion
you can look at it both ways
1) im a wrapper and i’m on your side and helping you to get your first property and a roof under your head. If its not too much to ask i will sell it to you for a slightly higher price and a slightly higher interest rate, which i think is quite reasonable. If you agree lets be partners in wealth. At the end of the day, my intentions are for both of us to be happy – you with a house and me with positive CF wealth.
2) im a wrapper and although i have this goodie image of trying to help you at the end of the day all i want is my CF and if you want the property then come on my terms albeit a little higher, but thats what you got to pay for if no one else would lend you money. I’m not forcing you but life’s unfair, you can take it or leave it. If you can’t pay later, tough
At the end of the day, love me(Celivia), or hate me(Pisces) one can intellectualise any situation suit our conscience(I know I have been guilty of it many times) but at the end of the day it boils down to “What are my intentions”
Wrapping is not all bad i suppose if you give a sh$# about other people.
>>Bringing this back to property – or at least investments – knowing more than the other party is a key point in many negotiations. If you know you can redevelop the land for a profit then you don’t tell the seller about this.<<
Aceyducey, so many people go on about the vendor not receiving the right kind of price.
Let us look at a farmer who grows wheat. He sells the wheat for a certain price and the buyer goes throught the process of turning it into flour and passing it on to the next person who turns the flour into bread. It then is distributed to shops who put their margin onto it as well.
If a loaf of bread is say $ 2-00 and the wheat required to make the bread was sold by the farmer for 10 cents, does that mean that the farmer was underpaid ?
So many people appear to think so different from you and me.
BTW, the three conclusions you drew is just one way of trying to understand the universe. It may be correct or it may not be correct. We don’t really know of course.
Pisces
>>Pisces, don’t be angry its just my opinion<<
Fjficm, what makes you think I am angry ? I am merely putting forward my way of looking at things and you even have the right of reply. [biggrin]
You even have the right to tell me I am wrong and, if I see the light, I will acknowledge my mistake.
>>…… but at the end of the day it boils down to “What are my intentions”<<
The way we (i.e. you me. EVERYONE,) are made we all act first and foremost from a position of self interest. A good argument can be put forward for example that a woman like Mother Therese’s endeavours were purely motivated because it pleased her to help others.
If that hadn’t been the case she would have found a different line of work.
I am not interested one iota in someone’s intentions so much as in how that person’s actions affect me.
Why would I give a sh.t if a bad guy sells me a house as long as the terms are favourable to me ? Where do his intentions come into play ?
The other person is only trying to make a living, trying to survive and, if such a person is rather succesfull at it, trying to increase his wealth.
Why would that matter to me ? In the end that person cannot take it with him anyway and in the process he has been very creative thus benefiting a large number of people.
The one and only reason I responded to your post, Fjficm, was because it appeared as if there was a nice bit of character assassination in there which came through as rather self righteous on behalf of the writer.
In other words, your post concentrated on the person rather than on the good outcomes of that person’s actions.
That attitude caused you (so it seems to me) to put forward an unreasonable, undefensible, proposition that a person like Mr Otten acts in an unfair manner if he insists that the wrappees obligations need to be adhered to.
I note that you haven’t as yet addressed what I said when I asked you to tell us why one would condemn an individual but not the banks when both parties’ actions are motivated by a need to avoid going under.
Regards,
Pisces
I love great debate!
“Dont be looking in your back yard for a four leaf clover when the opportunity of a lifetime could be knocking on your front door….”
Hi All.
Pisces you have hit the nail on the head with your first post. Everything that happens, I believe, is for a reason and you may not understand why at the present but I believe that eventually if you are meant to undertand why it will be revealed.
My daughter is 4 years old. We have a S/C fire. In July last year she burnt herself quite badly on it. She knew not to go near it and isn’t the kind of child to disobey. However she somehow managed to get behind it and get burnt. I was really angry because I had spoken so much about it to her.
In taking her to the doctors to get the burn checked we thought we would get out son (10 months old) weighed and general check up. The doctor felt a massive tumour in his abdomen (we just thought he was chubby). He had kidney cancer (Wilm’s Tumour) and has since had chemotherapy and his kidney removed.
I guess the moral is, if our daughter hadnt burnt herself then we wouldnt have picked up his cancer and it would have spread. It was highly agressive and would have killed him. He is the picture of health today.
You may not always understand why things happen but dont be fooled into believing their is no purpose for the action.
Here’s to all the kids in Camperdown ward at Westmead Hospital this Easter and thoughts and prayers for them and their families.
Happy Easter All,
Rachel.[biggrin]
Wow Rachel, I had goosebumps reading your story! I’m so glad all has worked out for you and your little guy.
Cheers
MelTry working on the principal:-
“Do unto others as you would have them do unto you”
I do – or at least try to.
I can look at myself in the mirror each morning and feel comfortable.
Also if i’m in a quandary as to what to do in a problematical situation it always supplies an answer.
Not preaching just trying to suggest an option!
rgds
Cobra
[suave2]
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