Howz it goin’?
I have done a little research on buying in NZ and have located some good positve CF prop.
I just wanted to ask the question for any Aussies that invest there, what structure do you buy from (Aussie Trust, NZ Trust, individual ??), and what is the process of the transaction (How do I pay from Aust. to NZ)And what are the tax implications on profits?
Any info will greatly be appreciated! Also a suggestion of any finance, accountants, solic. that are familiar with Aussies investing in NZ.
Anyone from Sydney that has any info, I would like to take them out to dinner to discuss further.
I am also considering moving there, will I need a visa??
I have been to New Zealand once and it was the most spectacular country I’ve ever seen.
Thank you
JohnBoy.“The Knowledge of the world is only to be acquired in the world, and not in a closet”
-Lord Chesterfieldhey john boy
i have numbers of both mortgage brokers and insurance brokers plus my lawyer, all used to dealing with Aussie investors. Even the small town rural real-estate agents are almost blase about o’seas investors buying properties they’ve seen on the net, as it’s happening more and more these days.For banking, I re-opened a local bank account and do what I can via internet banking, (payments, checking rent has been paid by property managers, etc) and also my accountant has a chequebook for the other things such as settlements, etc.
yep there are some good bargains/yields over there as I’ve found and purchased!
if you want to move there on an Australian passport i don’t think you need a visa, as Australia and NZ have a reciprocal thing, that is, your passport is stamped on arrival and that’s about it. I’m living here no probs on a Kiwi passport. government benefits and health care are reciprocal too.
As far as tax goes, I’m buying as an individual, paying tax in NZ (my only activites in NZ will be property) and then my accountant in NZ will do a NZ tax return and send the details to my accountant here. You don’t get taxed twice though, it comes in as tax-paid money, i think. it’s too gnarly for me to understand, that’s why I have accountants, but straight forward for them. I do individual tax returns in both countries, no trusts or companies. (I lie, i do have a company, but nothing to do with properties.)
And yes NZ is spectacular, and small and easy to get around
(like you could do a reconnaissance trip around the whole country pretty thoroughly in 3-4 weeks, going to 90 percent of towns of 5000 or more, spending 2 weeks per island.)leave your email address if you want to chat further
long grain in surry hills is nice…heheMini
MiniMogi[
]It is starting to look like you are our resident NZ expert, I think Steve should leave a space in the program for you at the next seminar.[
]Cheers
Leigh K[]Read, learn, grow but most of all just do it.
Hi Guys
I’ve been watching this fascinating topic of investing in NZ with much interest for quite awhile.
I’ve recently sold a property in Napier and made a good CG on a negatively geared poperty. I am now looking with interest in some of the central North Island towns which are much cheaper to buy in, have low CG at the moment but show very good + cash flow.
In one town of about 12500 people I am looking at, had in June its best sales month ever. The 3 RE agents sold about 70 properties to a variety of people. They included investors from Australia, Greece and the USA.
Some of these properties were sourced through http://www.richmastery.com.
However in today’s NZ Herald an item of news mentioned that up to 150 people in this town could be made redundant in the next few weeks as there has been a big downturn in the forestry industry in the North Island.
However as one of the RE agents said people were moving here because of the central North Island location, affordability and lifestyle.
NZ has no CG tax.
I use a mortgage broker to source money for me.
The Richmastery web site has alot of information regarding investing in NZ.
http://www.realenz.co.nz is a national listing site by all RE agents for property for sale in all areas of NZ.
I hope some of you find this information useful and if anyone wants further information just ask.
Regards
jym>MiniMogi
i like it…
>It is starting to look like you are our resident NZ expert
oh, shhhhhow super embarassing, more like, I’m an expert at
sitting up later writing long waffling posts on a forum late at night and that’s about IT (did i mention, i really enjoy it!!!???)enjoy, enjolady!!
Hi minimogul
thanks for your post about NZ.
where abouts in kiwi land are you from, and i am i right that your NZ properties are in the north island?
do you keep a close eye on whats happening in NZ, i’ve been purchasing in waimate because of the good yeilds and project aqua, do you have any comments
regards
westan[8D]Hi Mini
I am very interested i talking to you about NZ
I have been looking at the north island
and need some contacts
you sound like the right person
I have been phoning NZ a lot and not getting much help
glenn
hey john boy
i have numbers of both mortgage brokers and insurance brokers plus my lawyer, all used to dealing with Aussie investors. Even the small town rural real-estate agents are almost blase about o’seas investors buying properties they’ve seen on the net, as it’s happening more and more these days.For banking, I re-opened a local bank account and do what I can via internet banking, (payments, checking rent has been paid by property managers, etc) and also my accountant has a chequebook for the other things such as settlements, etc.
yep there are some good bargains/yields over there as I’ve found and purchased!
if you want to move there on an Australian passport i don’t think you need a visa, as Australia and NZ have a reciprocal thing, that is, your passport is stamped on arrival and that’s about it. I’m living here no probs on a Kiwi passport. government benefits and health care are reciprocal too.
As far as tax goes, I’m buying as an individual, paying tax in NZ (my only activites in NZ will be property) and then my accountant in NZ will do a NZ tax return and send the details to my accountant here. You don’t get taxed twice though, it comes in as tax-paid money, i think. it’s too gnarly for me to understand, that’s why I have accountants, but straight forward for them. I do individual tax returns in both countries, no trusts or companies. (I lie, i do have a company, but nothing to do with properties.)
And yes NZ is spectacular, and small and easy to get around
(like you could do a reconnaissance trip around the whole country pretty thoroughly in 3-4 weeks, going to 90 percent of towns of 5000 or more, spending 2 weeks per island.)leave your email address if you want to chat further
long grain in surry hills is nice…heheMini
http://www.world-gazetteer.com/c/c_nz.htm#pl_244
here are population stats of most towns in NZ.
hi muppet – are you here or there? if you are here, did you see the NZ Herald article on-line?
Yeah – is your town Tokoroa? it sounds like it, give or take a couple of thousand. I put an offer in on a house in Tokoroa, didn’t get it, probably was too lowball, however somebody bought it probably for around 28-30K, made of untreated timber (*alarm bells*) which the agent said was ‘rotten in places’ (which means it’s a lot worse, if they’re volunteering that info) however tidy inside, huge 1600 sq m land close to town, and with sitting tenant @ 130 per week who was happy with the place. now don’t buy in places like this for capital gain cause you might not get it – might even go down. However looking at cashflow, that’s about, ooh, *gets calculator* a 24 percent gross return. Let’s say the population drops by 2 percent as is expected on the above web-site, you can afford to drop the rent by up to a whopping 5o percent or more and still end up cash-flow positive. So i think a house can always be rented at the right price, even in towns with declining populations.I have one which is not rented yet in a little town of 3000 after 2 weeks. Am I worried that it’s because it’s in the wrong part of town? Or it’s a bad house? No not at all, only because I am probably asking about 20 per week too much. I’ll drop it to 110 or 100 and it will rent. The rental agent and I just both decided to start it higher just to see what happened.
Even at 100 per week it’s still going to give me a 21 percent return. So….don’t be scared of investing in declining towns…nothing happens that fast….150 people leaving a town of 14000 is still OK….because of the decline, you can get the super-bargains, and if like me you believe that houses will never be that cheap again (like under 25 kiwi dollars) and if like me you don’t have that much to spend because you’re only just starting out and want to get comfortable doing deals and using a calculator on baby deals first up, then go for it. And I wouldn’t think you would be a lemming because buying in those kinds of places is so not the norm, and a lot of people will tell you you’re crazy.
i won’t be one of them though, I will say ‘yeah – go for it!’Westan as to do I keep a close eye on NZ?
Yes, i go there several times a year, and about once a year drive through the country a bit. Subscribe to the KPI magazine, look at properties online regularly.
I’m originally from wellington and have a lot of friends in Auckland where i used to live before i moved to Sydney, so yes, you are right, central north Island is where I have found opportunities. 3 hours south of Auckland. Also more convenient personally in case I ever need to/want to go to my IPs or renovate etc – having parents in wellington – than if I was buying in the South Island. but that’s only me. I’ve found as good or better deals in the South Island. I’ve heard of Waimate opportunities, (from you???? Thanks!!) and others such as in Marton (industries going in there) Milton (jobs being created) Oamaru (‘buoyant’ unquote – rental market -town is becoming a cute tourist eco-tourism pit-stop like Ballarat, instead of the run-down ghost town it was 10-15 years ago)
Dundedin (student accom does well) Christchurch (desperate rental crisis at bottom of the market, huge potential for student accom) New Brighton (beachside up and coming)
and also Invercargill (people swear by the deals to be found there, despite declining population – happening ‘character’ mayor Tim Shadbolt does wonders for the vibe of the town
Gore (+ve cashflow galore, last time I looked)you can still get absolute beachfront in the south island for
$$$ affordableetc etc
recovery, who are you phoning? in what way are you not getting much help?
what sort of contacts do you need? I found my lawyer through the yellow pages (!!!) but he’s been great, not to mention cheap – and my insurance broker through the yellow pages too!! They only make about 30 bucks commission anyway…
I can give you their names but like I said leave your email addresscheers-
MiniHi Mini
Thanks for the rap. No I am not in Tokoroa. In fact I live in a little town of about 30 people about 40kms from Taumarunui(pop 3000) where there are a number of $25000 houses rent about $100-$120 per week.Te Kuiti is also a nice little town close by. It has two freezing works and a hospital plus it services a large farming area.
I’m looking in Tokoroa in the $50-$70000 bracket. These houses are still + cashflow even on a P&I. This way will give me CG long term.
The PMs I talked too all had waiting lists of tenants for houses.So there shouldn’t be much trouble getting tenants.I”ll be sending the wife over on Wednesday to have a look in the houses I’ve short listed.
Regards
Hi Guys,
I have only just found this forum last night, have spent hours reading all your past comments on N.Z & have spent even more hours looking at Prop. on the sites that you all so gracious gave us.Am really enjoying researching this with a view to buy a few + c/f in the near future.Already have 2 in cairns but think N.Z has alot more to offer. I would like to know how you make offers on prop. in N.Z? Is it a verbal offer OR like in QLD you sign a contract with the offer on it & are then locked in if they accept? Thanks so much for all the great info you are posting, it really helps.Mini mogul, you make it sound so easy?
Cheers
DiamondHi Diamond and welcome,
yes i too find this forum fantastic.
as i do investing and particularily property investing.
in New Zealand you have to put in a written offer, but the rest is very similair to Oz. a good little book i picked up on a recent expidition to NZ was “residential Property investing in New Zealand” by Dudson and King. Seams to cover everything. i havn’t finnish reading it yet (the wife picked it up and she’s reading it). Or save your money cause minimogul seams to know most things. as i’ve mentioned before on this forum we are moving to NZ in January and i’ll be investing full time. Quit my job last week (actually asked for a year off without pay, finish work at the end of the year), anyway i’d be kean to catch up face to face with others interested in NZ, will be in Melb, anyone interested email me at [email protected] and i will let you know when we will get together.
westanHi Westan,
Thanks for the warm welcome & thanks for the advice on making offers. You really are serious about investing if you`ve ditched your job! Good on you lifes about experiencing differnet things & daring to be different. I will look for that book up here because unfortunatley I`m north of Sydney,would have loved to have a long chat with other NZ researches.
Are you locked in on the contract once the vendor has accepted? or do you have a cooling off period after which you can get out of the deal? I`m sure i will have lots of questions to ask you NZ experts over the next few weeks so bear with me, Cheers
Diamondmuppet – hi!!!
> 40kms from Taumarunui(pop 3000)
I am madly in love with Taumarunui, that whole area actually, I adore it. I wanna have t-shirts made up and start wearing ’em!!!!
Went there to do an emergency renovation on the worst house on the worst street! hahahah!!! (yes, learned, overspent, made mistakes, who cares, even the mistakes were still cashflow positive. Still think I did well!!!My second and third IPs are in Taumarunui, the first one I got is in Waverly. Never been to waverley, though remember driving through on the way to NP….
>where there are a number of $25000 houses rent about >$100-$120 per week.
yep yep that’s my budget, I have found that the best returns are usually when the house is for under 30K.
>Te Kuiti is also a nice little town close by. It has two freezing >works and a hospital plus it services a large farming area.
Yeah – and Waitomo caves tourism passes through….>I’m looking in Tokoroa in the $50-$70000 bracket. These >houses are still + cashflow even on a P&I. This way will give >me CG long term.
really, interested to hear that you see Tokoroa as a long term cap gain place???
>The PMs I talked too all had waiting lists of tenants for >houses.So there shouldn’t be much trouble getting tenants.
yeah that’s really good to know.Even Taumarunui seems to have rental demand
hi diamond
>Am really enjoying researching this
yeah isn’t it so much fun???!!!
> but think N.Z has alot more to offer.
It does have different things to offer, and I really think that it is behind Australia in almost any trend. From juice bars to property trends. So i think you could take what is happening here (if I could only figure that out) as something that could blow across the tasman in 6 months, a year, two. but I can’t qualify that other than as a hunch>I would like to know how you make offers on prop. in N.Z?
I ring it through the details and they are supposed to draw it up, fax it to lawyer, lawyer says OK, I sign. goes to the vendor to countersign. each agent has their own form, but the middle pages of it are the national standard contract everyone has to have.
‘that’s not how we do things in the King Country’ said the Taumanunui agent, he wanted to negotiate the price verbally with the vendor before writing up the contract. Small town, 3000 people, who was I to argue? Still got the house at the price i wanted. I’d probably been the first person for yonks that had been interested. Within weeks there were other Aussie investors crawling over the joint, and with nothing signed and a verbal offer only ‘on the table’ on another property, i lost a deal that way. without at all saying that my posting here has caused a stampede (which according to my research had already started this year, big-time), several people (- at least- from this site, and that’s only the ones I know about) have bought/looked there, and this is a tiny town of 3000 that can only support so many Aussie investors. …>you sign a contract with the offer on it & are then locked in if >they accept?
I think that any signed offer when counter-signed is locked in, isn’t it?
>Thanks so much for all the great info you are posting, it really >helps.
you are so welcome, thanks for the thanks, it’s always nice to hear it.
>Mini mogul, you make it sound so easy?
I really think that it is. !! Ever played cashflow? Even the janitor card can win the game.
OK I did spend a year learning the ins and outs, I read and read and read, (I have a whole shelf now!) – bought every tape and CD set I saw, spent a fortune on educating myself including 3 seminars, (one three day, the Australian Property Masters, which I repeated this year) studied the materials, looked for deals, used the personal mentoring that came with the Wrap Secrets Revealed Kit to ask Steve stuff to which he personally replied, (even just buy and hold advice-)
and it was Steve and David U that swung me into action in the end, by specifically telling me that i was not nuts, and that it was OK to buy without personally having seen the property, provided i did the due diligence. I remember being really impressed hearing Kim Kiyosaki at a one-night RK event talking about her first deal, and how all-consuming and completely scary it was to her.i think everyone’s first deal has an element of that to it, but I have to say, i never lost any sleep about buying these places –
they don’t make me at all nervous even in a worst case. Hey – they are all insured for more than i bought them for! The level of knowledge you feel you need or the element of risk you are prepared to take is different for anyone, but for me, I needed that much time to feel i completely understood what I was doing. It felt good to get the money working 4 times harder for me in a property than it was in a term deposit, put it that way. Yes, i think it is easy. it’s a few more phone-calls than a term deposit, say, 50 calls per property? And less on subsequent ones, you become more efficient.>Or save your money cause minimogul seams to know most
>things.
I so don’t, but if someone asks a question about NZ and i *don’t* know it and i think that i should know it (even just for myself) I go and try to find out. I’m pretty good at web research and you can find the answer to just about anything if you know how to look and can be bothered.
>as i’ve mentioned before on this forum we are moving to NZ
>in January and i’ll be investing full time.
yay! Congrats!!! wee hee!!
>Quit my job last week
wicked!!
westan – are you sydney or melbourne?cheers-
Miniminimogul
i’m in Victoria a town called stawell 220km from melbourne. when we go to New Zealand we are thinking of living in a house we bought in Balclutha 36k and split into two flats we will convert it back to one home to make it big enough for the wife and four kids (not that my wife is Big). will use this as a base. where are you?sydney isn’t it?
regards westanhey westan, next time I am in the south Island i will look you up, once you are there, that is!
Anecdotal story – an ex-Auckland friend of a friend bought a whole ex-school in Oamaru, (!!!!!!!!!!!!!) complete with classrooms and swimming pool, tennis courts, etc for the price of his house in Auckland! He just lives there with his family and loves it! people are making changes like that for the lifestyle they can get for their money!!
And if you are ever in sydney let me know!!
cheers-
MiniHello MiniMogul,
I’m also interested in NZ PIs (maybe something to do with my equal half being a Kiwi, hails from Wgtn, but we live in Syddddney), but I’m a newbie and trying to learn & absorb as much as poss. I was thinking of Hamilton, Tauranga and Taranaki…I would welcome any help & guidance you may offer on NZ PIs (eg contacts, process, etc). My email is [email protected] (propertyportfolio, I hear you say, what the hell, why not dream and think big).
Cheers, QB
P/S Just been to New Plymouth for a friend’s fortieh…each time I visit NZ, I’m amazed by its beauty and tranquility…equal half was abit worried that I was thinking of packing the family up and moving lock, stock and barrel to the land of the long white cloud !!!minimogul
great to have visits from you and other “propertyinvesting” forum member. You friends school in oamaru sounds great, and Oamaru is buzing as a community. (for those who don’t know pop about 12,000). wouldn’t mind living in oamaru but prices have pushed just a little to high for me. let us know if you are in Vic before Jan and i would be more than happy to travel to meet you. i’ll even buy you sux dollars of fush and chups. see i’ve been taking language lessons.
westanwestan –
>let us know if you are in Vic before Jan and i would be more >than happy to travel to meet you.
i will be at least three times if not more. Playing with two of the artists I play with etc etc.
>i’ll even buy you sux dollars of fush and chups.
Your accent needs a bit of tweaking, i can help you with that….’with thet’….
here’s a good one to say in a NZ accent –
Tum, Tum, Kwuk! Someone’s dinted the Sutroen ez they were driving over the brudge.(tim, tim, quick! Someone’s dented the Citroen as they were driving over the bridge.)
Here’s a joke an Australian made up about me on my first gig over here….
whaddya call a keyboard player from new zealand?
Baaaaaa- bara.
>see i’ve been taking language lessons.
yes we’ll work on that further!cheers-
MiniHi everyone,
Thankx mini & westan for all your extra info. I am about to organise my passport!!! So i suppose i have about 4-6 wks to do my due diligence & travel itinery.Have a new question for you. Do you know of a website or mag or real estate agent where i can get the vacancy rates for rentals in any particular town that i am interested in?Also, what do you all feel is an acceptable figure for vacancy . the reason I ask this is because it seems that most of the cheapies ie. below 40k appear to be in towns that don`t have a great deal of employment or are just plain freezing all year round.Your opinions would be appreciated.
Boy, am i enjoying this forum.Shame i didn`t find it years ago.
Cheers
DiamondHi Diamond!
>Do you know of a website or mag or real estate agent where >i can get the vacancy rates for rentals in any particular town >that i am interested in?
not really, just ask the RE agents where you are buying.
or pretend to be a renter!however this site is useful as it shows market rent info for NZ
http://www.minhousing.govt.nz/tenancy/Market-Rent/market%20rent%20region.asp
>Also, what do you all feel is an acceptable figure for >vacancy .
someone said allow 4 weeks per year in rural areas. i reckon that’s about right…if it doesn’t rent in that time drop the rent!>the reason I ask this is because it seems that most of the >cheapies ie. below 40k appear to be in towns that don`t have >a great deal of employment or are just plain freezing all year >round.Your opinions would be appreciated.
you can find out the actual employment rate here
use the search function. A lot of the towns have about twice the national unemployment rate, you are right.
If you are buying at the bottom of the market in these places you certainly might get a tenant on a benefit.>Boy, am i enjoying this forum.Shame i didn`t find it years ago.
i don’t think it was here years ago!
cheers-
mini
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