Hi there,
Has anyone heard of the NII (National Investment Institute). They offer a Property Investment educational program which runs for 12 months and costs $16,000 . They teach you different strategies to secure properties etc… I’m just wondering if anyone has done the program or knows anything about it. I’m keen on doing this as I’m quite new to property investment and would like to invest in my education before getting started. Help anyone [?]
Probably the most asked question on this group!
Yes you’re right that education is important. But instead of spending $16 000 in a single seminar, how about this alternative investment education budget?
$200: Pile of books on property investing and related topics
$100: membership of an investment group near you (eg Investornet in Melbourne)
$0: Browsing the net and archives of forums like Somersoft and this one. Also ask questions.
$0: Talking to banks/mortgage people re finance
$0: Attendance of auctions near you
$100: Phone calls to RE agents, etc
$100-500: Fares/Petrol for country trips to look at property, visit agents, etc.
$50-200: Buying reports of previous sales in areas of interest (eg Home Price Guide)You’ll have about $15 000 left. This is almost enough to put down a 20% deposit on a cheap country cashflow positive property. And by doing it, you’ll learn heaps and have an asset that pays you income!
As for HK, see previous dicussions re this. Other people may have different ideas, but just hearing his voice and manner of speech (on a recent 4 Corners) scares me and I wouldn’t go near him!
Peter
Good advice from Peter above.
I think evry regular on this forum would advise you not to go near Henry Kaye and his institute with a forty foot pole.
Mala……..
I am most of the way through the NII course you are talking about and have some suggestions for you. I have found the information in the course to be helpful to me and the presenters have been generally well informed, but they do tend to suggest that everyone can do all of the techniques they teach which is clearly not true…… they admit this in the presentations.
What you must be aware of is they methods they use to sign people up and their inclination to refer you to other services that also have big fees. Among other things, NII use the sales methods of Brian Tracy…. an american sales guru and seminar speaker who has identified “gap analysis” as a preferred way of selling a product or service to a prospect, ie you…! This concentrates on the gap between where you are now and where you want to be in the future financially and personally. Your NII sales consultants job is to widen that gap as much as possible then demonstrate how NII can be the “bridge”, helping you attain the money freedom…etc that your after etc etc.
So be aware that the questions they ask are not just general and off the cuff……. they are part of a defined system of selling you a product.
They are clearly out to manipulate your responses emotionally so that you will be very keen to sign up. The best approach in these situations is to make a strong statement up front that you can return to easily… before the sales pitch gains momentum. Believe me, these people are very persuasive and if you read the Four Corners transcript you will see they are using sophisticated techniques to manipulate your responses, ie, the “anti-sell” and “create pain” etc.
Start the conversation by stating that “I’m here for information only and I will not be signing any agreements or contracts tonite…. I need 2-3 days to consider my financial position.”
Have a look under the general discussion topic of “Dodgy” on the second page of this discussion forum and you will see a range of responses to the NII course
For Four Corners transcript see <http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/content/2003/transcripts/s836869.htm……> Its a report (program transcript) into the investment seminar industry and worth a read before you make any commitments.Some points;
1. 16k is a lot of money and represents a deposit on an investment property in itself, ie, 1 or 2 bedroom investment property within 10 km of the city. You could start your investment portfolio with this money.
2. There is a wealth (pardon the pun) of property investment literature out there which provides excellent information on how to get started and what to look for in terms of property investment. This would probably cost you less than $200.
3. Property www sites offer data on % rises in property values for various areas and suburbs of Melbourne so a lot of data can be accessed from these.Try; http://www.reiv.com.au/information/pg_info_medianprices.html
http://www.realestate.com.au/cgi-bin/rsearch?a=bhp&t=resIf you have the money to spare, the information can be helpful, but go in with some degree of wariness about what they are passing off as concrete facts
Re ‘Gap analysis’
Caloc thanks for the insight. That must be why (in the excerpt played on 4 corners) they demean where you are now and then try to get high expectations of future wealth, freedom, etc.
I suppose that’s why it doesn’t wash with me is that my gap is fairly small. My expectations are not particularly extravagent and (mainly due to my upbringing) have always had reasonable money & investment habits (as opposed to people with more lavish expectations, bad money habits and no savings/investments).
That’s not to say that I can’t do better, but I take exception to someone peddling dire predictions about my future if I don’t sign up for their course. It’s a bit like preachers warning of hell to non-believers.
Peter
Mala,
You can’t go past the advice offered by peterb.
My experience has taught me that most of these courses are GEE UP sessions designed to make you feel that you are suddenly the next Warren Buffet.
All the info you need is right in front of you.Free!
He’s a bit.1.Get friendly with a real estate agent that you won’t be buying off.Good for impartial advice.
2.Get a good accountant.dont ask the accountant for advice they are not trained to know.Let them stick to the tax and money side of things.
3. Remember that property investment is a game of numbers with a bit fortune telling thrown in.If the sums dont add up on a deal walk away from it.
4.Reasearch,and research.You can usually find any info for free and this is usually better than stuff you paid for because it does’nt come with conditions.
5.This one is purely a personal one, but don’t get involved in any investments that are expensively marketed, or any finance offers that rely on capital growth to make them sustainable.
6 A good way to start might be to take your 15k and look at unit in a retirement villiage. These are ususally reliable, trouble free and easily managed.If you buy one “off the plan” you save stamp duty and have good depreciation schedules.
You can buy them in eastern Melbourne for 135-150k, returning 150-165 pw.I have one in Carrum Downs and it has been a set and forget investment.
Just keep asking the questions.
Bye,
JoffYou guys are fantastic!! Thank you soooo much Peter, Colac, Kirby & Joff. Your advice is priceless and makes a lot of sense… I was in a rut yesterday deciding what to do.. But it’s all pretty clear now. Having heard everything through someone (Colac) who is currently doing the program, you have saved me a lot of time & money and is exactly the kind of information I needed to decide whether the program would have been the right thing for me..
Wondering also if any of you know a good accountant in Sydney, they are pretty rare from my previous dealings. Joff, also the retirement units in Melbourne you mentioned, is there anyone or anywhere I can get more info about this? Peter, joining a local investment group, I’m sure there are many here, but the right one?? Does Investornet have a group in Sydney? You guys are a wealth of knowledge !!
Cheers,
Mala[
]Mala……..
Try this accountant in Sydney…. Shukri Barbara at Property Tax Specialists…[[email protected]]….www.propertytaxspecialists.com.au …..He does seem to be very knowledgeable in the property investment area….. he also sends out a free newsletter and runs very affordable small seminars for less than $60 if I remember correctly…
Worth a phone call or email…..
By the way….its Caloc…. Good Luck….
Hi Mala,
There is some really good advice here!
OK I am going to ramble so feel free to skip this post if you don’t have the time to read it…What peterp said is excellent and very true. It is interesting how some people will be ready to pay someone $16,000 to spoon feed them when ALL the info is out there (especially on the net).
It is very interesting how some people will be happy to pay $16,000 but won’t check prices on residex or homepriceguide! or even buy a book and readit! or even buy an ice cream for their kids. (OK do you see what I am getting at…)
It is funny how poeple will spend big amounts on some things and winge on little things. (ANY STORIES; ANYONE?)
I think most of people do not have the time and believe that there is a magic formula that will make them rich , so they are willing to pay big money to find out…
OK let me tell you now; there is NO magic formula! and most of what these guys teach is available on the net. (Also ask specific questions on the forum and people will be more than happy to give you the answers.)
Actually I think (*am sure*) that a lot of these seminars are a means to get you more and more involved in an organisation. The sad thing is that they will get more and more money out of you.
Get a good team of people around you. (Like INVESTOR said don’t listen to everything your accountant tells you about investing…, but do listen to as many people as possible and filter the junk out).
Run away from financial advisors as quickly and as fast as you possibly can. (They are only there to bleed money out of you. OK there are 0.001% that are good … I still haven’t met one though…)
** End of ramble
*************
Australian Property Software
APIM: http://www.apim.com.au
APDM: http://www.apim.com.au/apdm.htm
*************G’day APIM,
My turn now!
I couldn’t agree more! People want to be told how to get rich, and they will pay extortionate amounts to find this info out, yet they are unwilling to do the little things (mostly free) to make them rich!
The reason that I’m a little quiet about where I source my deals, is that I feel I’m doing a person no favours by telling them go to X place and you can buy a cashflow property. Sure they would probably buy a cashflow property, but they would not know how to find more with out being told again(similar to rich parents letting thier kids live the good life without teaching them the financial skills that got them thier wealth in the first place), you just have to go out and do it for yourself!The path to wealth will be vastly different from person to person and sorry APIM there is a magic formula![8D]
Here it is;
Hard work Dedication Focus and finally, Actually doing it(you’ll never build wealth unless go out and DO IT)Get out there and have a go, its the best seminar you’ll ever do![
]Cheers,
Scott SP.S. APIM I think the % rate of good financial advisors was a little high[
]“Aim for the stars and you’ll shoot the top of the telegraph pole. Aim for the top of the telegraph pole and you’ll shoot yourself in the foot!”
-anonanother cute ploy of NII is to send you emails that look like this,
Due to the fact that we have a large number of students wanting to attend [the conference] and because this exclusive weekend normally costs $4995.00 to attend, to reserve your seat we will require a holding deposit of $500.00 which we will only charge you if you fail to attend the event.
I will contact you over the next 24 hours to confirm your attendance and organise your personal invitation to be sent out to you …
and they have the nerve to sound upset when you tell them you have no interest in attending their latest greatest seminar/course/etc.
Mala,
Well,all that advice you won’t get at seminars.
The retirement units I mentioned are available all over Melbourne and what i said about them is true,but you still need to do your own research.Try visiting your local Real estate agent and tell them exactlywhat you are looking for.Write down your requirements first(based on your exaustive research!) and do not deviate from them.Let the agent do some of the leg work for you.If they suggest you look at properties that do not fit your strategy, move on to another agent.
As they say “The profit is in the buying not the selling”
Bye,
JoffHi everyone,
I was lucky not to get involved with NII, and now I can see that I was probably very right to do so.
But…
This is exactly the same reason why I did not attend Steve’s seminar. May be Steve will be not very happy to see this, but I actually think that no seminars are good value for money.
This view clearly contradicts with the view of many on this forum that last Steve’s seminar was a great success.
So, the specific question is, how one can tell that NII’s seminars are bad and Steve’s are good, without attending BOTH?
Best regards!
noth’n says education like experiance, lay down a $16,000 deposit and learn for yourself
For me investing is something only talked about on online forums, to a few friends and at the odd investment group.
But it’s becoming more pervasive with numerous flyers in the letterbox (since I moved I haven’t put up a ‘no junk mail’ sign). And as I was taking out the rubbish tonight who called out but a door to door salesman from the National Investment Institute!
He was doing all the units in this complex (average rent $130pw, 1/3 students, 1/3 retired, 1/3 working) and moving from door to door. When he was next door I opened my door for a little while (cold outside) and heard things like ‘mezzanine finance’, 20-30% returns on money and education seminars.
He introduced himself and seemed impressed when I not only knew of the NII but also HK. I mentioned the things talked about 4-corners and that I did my own due dilligence. He said that heaps of people don’t have time for this and tried to defend the differential valuations (as mentioned on 4C). He said NII was not like the Qld property promoters and taught people to do their own due diligence. I also mentioned the network of solicitors and bankers (also on 4C) and he said NII was purely an educational organisation and sold no property to anyone. Also asked the guy how many IPs he had and he said one, but four on the way, with an aim to own 15!
Now why would someone doorknock at 6:30pm a block of 1 bedroom flats that would mostly be tenants and/or lowish income earners? Surely you’d instead target time-poor people that already have equity in their own houses? Do they not target their marketing? Or are they desperate???
Peter
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