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Best to avoid a joint loan if possible, for 3 main reasons
1. Unnessarily exposes the non owner to risk
2. hurts the serviceability of the non owner, and
3. Offers no benefits at allTerryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Is it correct to say that I pay back the LOC in part or in full, then only extract money from it again (in part or in full) for other investment purposes?
Thanks.
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This sentance is unclear.
If you have a LOC with a limit of $100,000 but a balance of $0 and you go and buy a golden potato peeler for $1000 the balance is ow $1000 and this is a private expense. No interest deductible.
But if you go and deposit $1000 into the LOC you will be paying the loan down to $0 again, so if you borrowed $50,000 for a deposit then the interest would generally be fully deductible as there is no mixing.
But if you borrowed $50,000 before paying pack the $1000 it would be a mixed loan and the deductible interest would be 50000/51000 x100 = aboout 98%
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
No you can’t. Both stamp duty and CGT will be assessed at market value. There will also be tax and asset protection issues with receiving a gift so best to structure this as a sale at full market value, properly contracted.
consider also parents just keeping as is to save costs. It could be gifted to you eventually via the will with no stamp duty or CGT triggers.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
The offset will be linked to PPOR deposit/loan as this is not deductible anyway. The funds in the offset account will be used for next IP and a seperate loan will be created for the 2nd IP as this will still be included as the PPOR loan now being lets say 200k against PPOR loan
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My advice is don’t do this.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
You are borrowing now to invest in a savings account. later you will invest. This breaks the direct connection between the borrowing and the production of assessable income. you might still be able to argue the interest is deductible as you can trace the borrowings.
But if you put $1 or more of cash into that offset account it will be a mixed loan and you will have to apportion the interest.
This is why a LOC is better – it can be set up now but you then borrow to invest at the time of the investment by just transferring the money then.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Best to get a lawyer who can advise on building contracts.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Yes you could borrow extra and have the cash deposited into an offset account.
But, better not to do this as you will run into tax problems. use a LOC instead.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Still not clear.
Sounds like you are borrowing $240 secured against the PPOR and will then place this in an offset account = Not good.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Not a good set up.
1. What do you mean the deposit of the IP will be in the offset? if you borrow to park into an offset you run the risk of destroying the deductibility of interest. If you are saving a saving a deposit in the offset then you are wasting deductions as you will be using cash for an IP while you still have non deductible debt
Why would you want an offset account on an IP while you still have non deductible debt? You would be throwing money away by doing this.
Please elaborate on the last sentence.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Generally deposits are held in trust for the vendor. This means it is still your money until certain conditions are met – such as completing the contract.
I just reviewed a contract which allowed release of deposit and I quickly struck this clause out as there is a risk the vendor won’t complete and could go bankrupt or someone else could put a charge over their property and it may be impossible to get the money back.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Terryw wrote:</div>
Take the 23% from the LOC and borrow 80% on the IP = 103%….ok but you have now cross colateralised his loan…..isn’t this what everyone is saying not to do?
No crossing here.
LOC secured against PPOR
IO loan secured against IPTerryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
How would you set-up the loan for your 1st IP to avoid cross cat?
We owe nothing on our PPOR and were going to use the equity in it for a deposit and have the other 1/2 put in an offset account.
Split loan – one for deposit against PPOR
– One for the IP loanWith an offset account sitting in the middle helping reduce Interest repayments on both loans
Thoughts?
Never borrow to put in an offset account. This is very dangerous as it could ruin the deductibility of interest.
Use a LOC on the PPOR, borrow only to invest.
Set up an IO loan on the investment property and attach a offset account to this. All wages and rents into here.Take the 23% from the LOC and borrow 80% on the IP = 103%
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Define ‘best’ first!
This is such a broad question it is impossible to answer. but generally you might want to consider that units may have less land value than houses. Land values generally increase, but the value of the buildings gradually decreases as it ages.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Basically
1. via loans
2. via ownershipOne party can lend to the other and/or the parties can jointly own the property, either directly of indirectly.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Thinking about the Lyons case further. Mr Lyons became bankrupt at some stage after lending SMSF funds to the brother in law (BIL). This loan was between the SMSF trustee and BIL – and would generally be legally enforceable, even if no contract or deed entered into, for up to 6 years after the loan was made.
If Lyons was bankrupt the trustee in bankruptcy would stand in his shoes and control the assets of the bankrupt. These assets may include shares in the trustee company. Therefore a trustee in bankruptcy could potentially control the trustee company and thereby the SMSF. It could then sue the BIL to recover the money. Not that there is any point really as the money would come back into the SMSF and usually couldn’t be attacked by the trustee in bankruptcy. But it could have happened. Nearly $200k was lent so the BIL put himself at huge risk doing this.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Here is a case, from 2014, where the member caused the fund to lend to a relative who them lent the money back to the member – who later went bankrupt!
Deputy Commissioner of Taxation v Lyons [2014] FCA 1353.
An SMSF trustee has been fined $32,500 for lending money to a related party, in a recent Federal Court case,
http://www.solepurposetest.com/news/smsf-trustee-fined-32500-loan-relative/Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Best to look at the actual laws in relation to this
see http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/sia1993473/
SIS Act
look at Part 20, from sections 157 onwards. also Part 21Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Yes, one of my tenants died.
But the lease does not stop immediately at death. Notice must still be given and the estate is still liable up to this point.
See the actual law on this
s108 RTA (NSW)
http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/rta2010207/s108.htmlYou cannot dispose of someone else’s assets. The family will usually come to collect these. You need to be careful about giving access to family too as you don’t want to give access to the wrong person who then removes property without authority.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Yes. Ownership is changing so new loans are needed. Discharge of mortgage and new mortgage. Seek legal and tax advice too as many issues.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Depends on the terms of the contract.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au