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  • Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    @terryw
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    Redwood wrote:
    G'day QLDs007, 

    Our fees are clearly stated on our website firstly this includes custodian trustee (including ASIC fees) plus custody deed.

    Let me clarify $1750 is for bare trust or Limited Recourse Borrowing Agreement (LRBA) set up NOT SMSF set up.

    Are you saying $1750 is steep? please prove me wrong here.

    As you know ASIC fees are just under $500. Excuse me if we are on different pages, however, I will stand by our fees 100% as has been mentioned in the thread, many others charge much higher for these services (up to $5k) and many of our clients are extremely attracted by our fees and more importantly our experience in the area.

    Please clarify what your quote of $950 involved as if it was for custody deed plus custodian trustee it just would not be sensible in my opinion in consideration of ASIC fees for setting up a company plus labour.

    I charge about $1000 for a company set up plus $1000 for the custodian deed plus GST, so $2200 all up. So your fees are reasonable.

    But I am a lawyer and a mortgage broker and I often thrown in a free Custodian deed here and there if the client gets the loan through my broking company – they are not as complex as the SMSF deed.

    Also include legal advice in the above as well. There are complex legal issues with trusts.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    Not claiming depreciation throwing money away.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    tigermiger wrote:
    The house figure to buy my ex out has been agreed and I think my next step now is to get a home loan solely in my name.

    Because I am not sure if I will rent it out or live in there, am I best to get an I.O loan?

    My mum has generously offered to but her savings into my offset account (as she is currently taxed too much), provided I get a will prepared to outline that it is her money. Can anyone see anything wrong with this? I believe if it is in an offset account, I can take her money in/ out whenever she asks for it and I won’t get penalized and while it is sitting in their it is helping me?

    IO loan would be best as it allows you to maintain a high loan balance and with the offset you can still achieve interest savings.

    There are many issues with the mum’s money. She should seek legal advice. At the very least you need a written loan agreement and consider what would happen to her money if you:
    died
    became insane/into a coma
    separated
    went bankrupt – she would be an unsecured creditor.

    Also having a will won’t help her as it is her money. You can’t leave her her own money – she would be entitled to the money back anyway. However it is still a very good idea to have the will and there may be a few strategies which could be employed

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    mathyland12 wrote:
    Thanks to all who have responded

    After speaking to some friends over the weekend, they said they were scared off buying real estate with SMSF due to the fees involved and then the time taken to manage the fund. 

    Is there any advice to this?  How much does it cost to set up a SMSF so that it can buy real estate? 

    Mat

    Yep it is rather costly.

    I, as a lawyer, charge $4k to $5k to set up the SMSF and custodian. You need 2 trust deeds and 2 companies.
    You may also need financial advice

    The lenders will also charge you a fair bit, a large app fee and/or fees to review the deeds

    You will have ongoing fees such as tax returns and auditing and ASIC fees

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    Paterson00 wrote:
    Thanks for the info.  I'll be losing that straight away then since my wife will be running a dog boarding from our house as soon as we buy it. She runs a dog walking business at the moment and she has a lot of requests for boarding which we cant do in our rental.  If I have lost that already, I may as well make as much from the property as possible in income so long as the insurances make it viable.

    Think about some ways to structure this. perhaps you could buy it and rent to her business or a trustee could buy and you could rent from the trust and then claim part of the rent as a busniess expense etc

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    Paterson00 wrote:
    Well that's opened my eyes to something I didn't yet know too.  I didn't know that there was such a thing as CGT exemption on your main residence so thanks for that, good news.  Presumably that's as simple as it sounds.  If you make a gain on the property you live in, there is nothing to pay on tax on the gain?

    Unfortunately in the world of tax law, and law in general, nothing is simple.

    To get the main residence exemption there are lots of conditions such as:
    – individual owner
    – only counting one residence (even between spouses- including defacto)
    – less than 2 hectares
    – no used for business or income producing purposes
    – moved in as soon as practical after settlement
    etc
    etc

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    rc388 wrote:
    Hi after reading Steves book on trusts I generally understand the usefulness behind asset protection however am I also missing something? The loan on which the asset is typically paid for is secured by the bank so they have legal right to sell etc if repayments are not made; most land lords take out rental insurance in the event a Tennant gets injured etc and you can’t distribute losses for negative gearing

    I’m looking to start to buy an IP so any advice on structures would be appreciated

    Thanx

    Think about what would happen if you were to be sued – non related to the tenants, but outside, such as business collapse.

    Also there are ways to set up so as to reduce the personal guarantees and thereby reduce risk. Remember the motto “always ask for a personal guarantee but never give one if ‘possible’ “

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    Very true!

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    SHould I sell all my shares in a few weeks??

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    It would be taxable income and yo would lose the main residence CGT exemption.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    Tresbeaus wrote:
    I have a question regarding the use of structures to own property.I have been reading so many differing opinions its doing my head in. If you use a Trust structure to own property,do you lose the benefit of being able to claim costs of holding the property ie interest on loan,depreciation,maintenance and so on against your income?

    It is not so much as using ‘structures’ but ‘how to structure’.

    A trust is a separate enetity for tax purposes. You won’t be able to claim anything, the trust will claim expenses, depreciation etc. If there is a profit this will be distributed. If there is a loss it will sit there, only to be offset by future gains.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    Consider forming a SMSF with another family member?

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    Qlds007 wrote:
    For what ?

    Cheers

    Yours in Finance

    Administering debt agreements!

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    What is a debt agreement administrator?

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    Sounds like your broker has given you what you asked for. It is not wrong, but could have been set up more effectively I think. However, if this property were never to be rented out it won't matter too much. You are only disadvantages in the relatively short time before you move in, and even then probably not much.

    But, if there is a slight chance that this property may one day be rented out again then consider a IO loan with a 100% offset account.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    Just keep reading, with a critical eye, and you will learn.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    jate wrote:
    Thanks Terryw and PLC. You guys are always so quick and on the ball on these forums.

    Glad that you can provide such helpful hints and advice for us all.

    All these new accounts I've suddenly acquired from my mortgage broker after refinancing/restructuring was really confusing me.

    Very different to the simple days I used to have things where each accounts only corresponded to its property. It was neat.

    Decided to map this out in a diagram today at work to get my head around how things used to be and possible options how I can go about things moving forward (see below). Hopefully i've got things right now *fingers crossed*

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B027-SCim7iANlJLVVJELVhOTEE/edit?usp=sharing

    Let me know if you got some better tips/suggestions?

    Hope your broker is not giving tax advice.

    I am not sure I understand your diagrams. Do you have an offset account and a separate account savings account? All rent and income should probably be going in the offset account.

    Do you have 2 LOCs? If so, Any reason?

    What does the highlighted bit mean? Are you using one LOC to pay the interest on the other LOC or another loan? This would be capitalising interest – see my comments above

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    ClintBlakemore wrote:
    well i can redraw the money back as i have been to do up the house… i know i stuffed up after i saw my accountant.

    the 100k loan is based on my current loan i have at the moment plus what i can add to the loan towards another house

    My girlfriend is heavily considering going in with the other property that we want to live in.

    Im just a beginner to all of this and if a broker can give me a better insight then ill try to see someone

    Its tax advice you need.

    Redrawing money out of a loan = new borrowings so the interest on that part won’t be deductible if you use it to acquire a new main residence.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    FMS wrote:
    Terryw wrote:
    You are incorrect here. An offset account is completely different to redraw. You could be creating a very messy and costly situation by using redraw.

    I suspect sanasar may have been given incorrect advice at branch level in regards to offset v redraw as they will tell people it is the same thing?

    I had a bizarre conversation with a branch staff member just yesterday when one of my clients went into a branch to transfer IP funds from a PPOR offset back into the redraw of the IP loan. She said what I was doing was "very strange". I attempted to explain contamination of funds to her after she asked why I wanted to transfer the funds back to redraw but she was not interested in the answer. One staff member at a previous branch she visited the same day refused to do it as it 'wasn't necessary to move the funds as she was offsetting interest on her PPOR therefore it balanced itself out!"  What the!!!!

    Not one for bank bashing as I see them as business partners but the general ignorance is astounding. I guess you don't know what you don't know but then hearing the correct strategy and not being interested in the answer is what perplexes me even more so. 

    I would suspect you are right!

    Bank staff cause the majority of the tax problems with investing that I see.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
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    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    Oh dear! You have been paying down a rental property loan. This would cost you thousands of dollars in extra tax and interest over the years.

    You should speak to a broker about your borrowing capacity as you may be able to afford both. Get some tax advice too about how to structure things so as to save some tax.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

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