Forum Replies Created
Hey Westan,
>Hey Mini are you on commission with the NZ tourist dept?
no way!!!
>You can’t help telling us how Beautiful you Home is.
I was just really filling in people here about what Wanaka is and why it’s a place that costs big bucks to buy now
(like Queenstown.)>No arguments from me, and i hear they aren’t bad at that >rubgy thing.
I’m soooo out of the loop in regard to how NZ is doing in sports these days. However I live in a cricket-mad house so I’m kinda down with that in a disinterested girl kinda way…
Westan – well when you’ve bought up what you want *then* tell the forum where it is, cause then it really will boom, hehe!!!
*boom boom*
cheers-
Mini
PS Recovery, have a great time and good luck!!Hi there Giddyap,
I live in Sydney and I have *both* the games, Cashflow 101 and 202.
I would be prepared to lend it to you for a few weeks, or you could buy it off me if you want your own one. Leave your email if you want.
I’ve played it lots of times and if you have any kids around over about 8 they can play it too, and I tell ya, it’s so fabulous to see even the kids ‘get it’. And it’s GREAT for teaching them maths without them realising it! Our resident child was crazed on it when I first bought it.
Any kid that can play Monopoly can play cashflow right along with the Big Kids.
cheers-
MiniHi there single mum
I am in a kind of similar situation as you – I can’t afford to buy where i want to live (inner city Sydney) and as a freelance self-employed muso I’m probably the average bank’s worst nightmare, hehe,
but like you I had a lump sum to start with, and after discussing it with Steve he suggested I buy with cash to buy a cashflow-positive property, get it rented, *then* go to the bank to get a line of credit against it. (use a good, recommended broker, because they know about all the non-conforming lenders too, or whatever you call them – they charge a bit more interest but they do lend to people the normal banks won’t.)
Anyway so let’s say you bought a 60K house somewhere as a rental, then you have the asset itself plus the rental income to show the bank. OK the amount of cash you have will limit the kind of place you can buy, and the areas, but I think there are still places available in Australia for under 60K that are CF+ve.
So let’s say they give you a portion of the value of the property as a line of credit, you could then use that as a deposit to get your next one, and so on.
It’s just another way you could do it.
Oh yeah, and I am still renting, and perfectly fine with it, my rent is partly tax deductible as I do my business from home and commandeer two rooms for the purpose….I have to be in the city for what I do anyway – also, my boyfriend and I calculated that if we bought the house where we live on a ten percent deposit (yah RIGHT!) we would be paying about 800 per week MORE than we are paying in rent. Also, it’s not so tax deductible etc if it’s your own house I think…???
I am pretty sure that even millionaire property moguls sometimes still rent their homes for that reason.
cheers-
MiniHi Westan
> looking is fun,
Hmmmm… I guess….but I found the novelty wears off a bit after about 10 or 20…Last summer I looked physically at houses over several weeks in NZ – found one – but I made so many mistakes – from getting emotionally involved/falling in love with the house, ‘wanting it’ too badly, then getting intimidated by real estate agents to up the offer or lose it to another buyer (which to this day I think was a bogus agent tactic) and to top it all off, the builder’s report turned out a super-dud so I pulled out.
So I felt like i wasted my summer holiday and got nowhere. All that time and energy and still no house. By that stage my boyfriend was climbing up the walls cause he was soooo sick of the word ‘property’ so I thought ‘i gotta find another way to do this that’s more time effective’.
>gives a chance to see the whole area.
>to be in the area and talk to the neighbours etc is very >valuable.I totally agree, I wish I had been able to do that with my ones too, however, it was questions I could have asked people such as the building inspector – or really any local that’s not involved with selling you the property. I was lulled into a false sense of security because the house had a long-term tenant with rental documents (who left as soon as it settled!) so I didn’t ask enough questions.
I think I’m going to get better at buying sight unseen as I know more what I need to know about a property I am thinking about buying, and how to find it out.
cheers-
MiniMy advice would be what Robert Kiyosaki says – only get advice from rich people!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That are sucessfull investors themselves!!!
(i.e. not me!!! I am not rich —- yet!!!!)
Steve and Dave, Robert Kiyosaki, Dolf De Roos, are all people that have basically made the contents of their minds available to all.
There may be some people in your life that you know that could qualify but if you’re anything like me, the people I know that are rich are doing different kinds of investments now (like with lots more zeros) as they’re at a different point int their lives and started a long time ago. The things that they would ‘advise me to do’ would be good for them but are at the moment way out of my price-range.
I have found that advice from people such as Steve and Dave (through the seminars and now, hooray, a book ) have been way more appropriate for me – especially as I am just starting out and need entry-level advice. Basically- I am just pretty much following a strategy that someone who’s already done it with great success has taught me. Steve and Dave.
dave’s buy and hold strategy of buying an investment property every three months for 5 years and then pay them down to end up with freehold +ve cashflow in 10 years is the best scheme that I have ever heard of that I can relate to and seems ‘doable’. I am going to try very hard to stick to this until I have achieved the same result.
cheers-
Minii totally agree with everything Kirby said.
I also think that if you are buying cheaper properties it almost doesn’t work out if you have to travel to buy them.Being limited to buying in an area I can physically inspect at a moment’s notice wouldn’t have worked for me – neither time-wise or money-wise, as I live in Sydney, and can’t afford to buy a negatively geared property in Sydney or surrounds (yet). If I hadn’t bought ‘sight unseen’ in NZ cheaper areas (subject to builder’s report and as much due diligence as i could think of at the time) I still wouldn’t be ‘in the game’.
cheers-
Minihello lovelies,
OK I read the article (about nZ)
and here is my ‘rebuttal’…hehe> A house sale in Wanaka was in the news recently. The >owners bought it in 1968
> for $7,500 and sold it for $820,000.that’s be about right for Paddington, Sydney, too though eh???
> e? It’s not as amazing as it seems.
The media are not as smart as they seem!!!!
> It works out an annual rate of 14.4 per cent, which is high >but not
> astounding.Hang on – that’s totally not taking into account that there’s a bucket load of equity to play with that you could use /could have used – to purchase further investments, which would also go up in value…if you’d started doing that way back you could have got a few more properties for $$ now worth $$$$$ – add rent into that…subtract depreciation and other written off expenses….no cap gains tax in NZ either…. and would you have made that with any other investment? if so, let me know. !!
> e? It could give readers false hopes.
The media could be giving readers false fears.
!!cheers-
MiniPS
Wanaka – Queenstown -aaargh!!! Dreamy Places. See Lord of the Rings – Wherever you see mountains and rivers, it’s all that neck of the woods.one more thing on this point as I recently re-watched the video that had the gurus talking about the market (particularly Sydney, as the speaker was a Sydney developer.)
They first asked the audience ‘what factors drive the market?’ to which people yelled out things like ‘interest rates, the economy, inflation, supply and demand, population, confidence’…
…correct…but…
out of those factors very little has changed since when the sydney market (for example) was supposed to be ‘hot’ to now, when it is supposed to be ‘a bursting bubble’. interest rates have come down a bit, but that is supposed to buoy the market, isn’t it???OK there is perhaps an over-supply of brand new apartments, but the *main* thing that has changed is confidence – and why is that? the media….
I rest my case….
The Gospel according to seminars and books I have read, is that
banks look at three things – credit history, equity, and income/liabilities.
Banks calculate that you can afford 30 percent of your income on repayments. The LVR goes down (in their favour) in steps as you borrow more (like over 500K and over 1 million.).
If you are borrowing to purchase a cashflow positive investment that works after costs on an 80 percent vacancy rate, they don’t look at your income.cheers-
MiniI have only recently realised the power of writing down goals with a dead-line against them and the correlation of that simple act with actual success. It’s a well-documented fact!!
Sure, I had plans, I’ve certainly talked them through enough times, but have I written them down? no! Have I put a deadline against them? NO! That was my big mistake – I’ve found that if you *don’t* put a deadline down for yourself, the task tends to expand to fit the available time….so things take forever….
*off to write down goals with deadlines*
cheers-
MiniHi there,
http://www.stats.govt.nz
(statistics NZ website has much more in depth info per area etc)OK…according to one website the overall makeup is….
European 86%
Maori 9%
Pacific islanders 3%Sure, you have the Once Were Warriors situations- but that’s about as realistic a picture of the Maori in NZ as a gang movie set in South Central LA is of black people in the US!!!
(go see ‘Whale Rider’ for balance!!)
Overall, Maori and Pacific Islanders in NZ are present at all levels of society, be it politics, law, police, airlines, the media, film making, you name it –
There was even a treaty between British immigrants and the Maori way back when NZ was settled. Even though the Maori have pretty much felt ripped off ever since for letting their land go so cheaply – a sentiment perhaps shared by anyone who ever sold a property where the area went up a zillion percent since they sold – and even though the government is forever trying to settle once and for all – the fact that the treaty existed at all makes NZ very different from most countries that now have a dominant ‘white’ culture that took over from the indigenous one.
The result today is that the country as a whole sees the Maori culture as ‘their’ culture, and it is reflected in things like that now, white people know how to (and bother to) pronounce the words properly (unlike my Dad’s generation) . White NZers – ‘pahekas’ – are pretty careful to be respectful of the Maori – with everything that that entails.
If you go to visit there, you will see evidence of this everywhere – from the bi-lingual names for Government departments, to the content on TV.
OK so bringing this back to property investing….the north Island has more Maori than the South Island, some of the regional towns more so, ditto certain suburbs of Auckland. So it’s just par for the course really.
A lot of the towns with high yields have lower-than the national average incomes, which is a better indicator of why tenant-scarpering happens than anything else.
My property manager for one of my properties might be Maori – going on her surname – and to my surprise she actually asked me if I was OK with Maori tenants, that it was an area with quite a few Maori – and I said I was totally fine. It was interesting that the question was even asked.
The ‘best builder in town’ recommended to me in one town was a Maori, as were the two local labourers we hired to help. The builder chap was neat, and may even become ‘famous’ as the Jamie Durie character on an upcoming NZ programme entitled ‘Marae Makeover’!!!!!!!
So don’t worry – it’s part of the culture and it’s there to stay.
If you ever decide to visit NZ you will experience the wonderful cultural diversity for yourself and be able to understand how it works, and what it means to the land, the people, and the society.cheers-
MiniHi All
here is my 2 cents worth….> Wairoa,
Yeah – I was looking there.
Just the other day I saw a property advertised that was showing a staggering 35 percent yield, based on paying the full list price – and if you got it for a bit less, say 10 percent less, the yield would be and even more staggering 39 percent.
Unbelievable. The risks are – are those figures correct? What condition is the place in? What is the vacancy rate? What kind of tenant does it attract? Good or bad area?I was kinda looking in that area at a couple of 3 bdr houses a while ago, what put me off is that one, advertised as having a tenant, and which was being managed by the same agent who was selling it, turned out to not have one – and the RE agent only disovered this when I asked about some info about the tenant – ‘is the tenant happy with the house? Wants to stay?’ – then the agent made a call, went around there, and found out the tenant had scarpered. It’s a bit of a tenant scarpering kinda town.
I guess all properties at the bottom of the market run those risks, though!! What I am trying to do which I hope is gonna work out for me is provide a competitive quality of accommodation (i.e. fixed up, cleaned up) compared to others in the price-range so tenants never want to leave…!!!
A very nice RE agent Denise Whitmore there who seems to have lots of time for potential customers.
>Hawera….. (near where you have been buying i think)
yeah not far – I bought in Waverly which is 30K out of Wanganui. 1500 people approx. Hawera is toward New Plymouth a bit further, I think.
>Tokoroa
yeah – Tokoroa, missed out on one there, to someone who paid (in my opinion) far too much for it considering it was made of untreated timber….REALLY nice RE agent there too, one who is passionate about property and loves her job. Really. She told me!! Jenny Lamberton at Lamberton’s.
Wood/trees is the main thing there…not sure how it’s doing…however it’s within cooee of Hamilton which is a major growth place- I always thought that growth would eventually flow on to places like Tokoroa. Putaruru had some CF+ opportunities – in fact there was one I noticed that richmastery had stitched up on their property-finder’s service…in fact go check out what kind of places they are buying in….> Huntley.
I have heard there is some industry going in there? was it from you westan? Ditto Marton.> This is a dumb question.
it is so not, there are no dumb questions. In fact asking questions is THE smartest thing to do. Lots of ’em. And then some more!!!
>I have been talking to the other half about possibly
> buying in NZ. Apart from the fear of buying so far away from where we live.
I had that too and it was David U and Steve McKnight that pointed out it was not unusual for investors to never see some of their properties!!
Out of my three, I’ve seen on (for four days when we painted it) and the other two I haven’t. Eventually I might go check them out if I am in the area, my BF is going over to sort out one of them actually. I am buying in a price range so low that there tends to be some sorting out to do.> No stamp duty on loan
> No stamp duty on mortgage
> Costs will be:
> Application fee for loan
> Legal/conveyancing costs
yep to all the above, my lawyer costs about 550 per house including conveyancing, titles, lodging documents, and all that legal palaver
> Inspection costs; building, pest and LIM
lim is a bit extra, around $110 , it varies per area
Sometimes in the small towns you can ask them to look up the file for free and get away with the info without having to have paid for the LIM!!!
Some towns, the builder’s report dudes have relationships with the council as they are there so often so maybe that’s an option to ask them to have a little looksy.
> Valuation report
I never do this – if it was a valuable property, maybe –
> Minimal settlement fees
anything like that is covered in the $550 I mentioned earlier> P.S also NO capital gain tax if it’s bought as a long term buy and hold
> Davo70 i’ve used a new zealand bank BNZ (owned by our NAB) got $0 application
> costs on the loan. Interest rates are a bit higher in New Zealand than Oz.I heard that the BNZ is not using brokers any more, you go direct. There’s another one – Kiwibank I think it’s called – that have the supposedly lowest rates. There’s another online mortgage thingie – hang on – will try to remember –
http://www.leveragefinance.co.nz
> Rod C when would you be going to NZ i’ll be leaving about the 21st. Check out
> Emerites airlines return to Auckland only $376 compared to 650+ with airNZ and
> qantas,
qantas is 499 if it’s off peak, advance purchase, and you stay a saturday night.
> also look at freedomair.co.nz for cheap flights often 450 return but
> not the choice of destinations.
Freedom fly to Hamilton, dunedin, palmerston north
so that might be even more convenient if that’s near where you are looking> Where the heck is “king Country”
central plateau, ruapehu, stunning country> That legal cost seemed high i paid about 700 i think plus 150 for the LIM.
> westan
yeah same – my tip is to get a small town lawyer. It’s not rocket science buying houses. Don’t need a slicko city one I don’t think unless you are doing wraps or other tricky stuff.> Ask Mini how she is doing with her house?
…….will let you know for sure!!!!> I noticed this week for the first time a Prop Man advertising for tenants in
> Taumarunui. Not sure what this means though.
no – what does it mean? Where, here? What? how???> Another small country town to consider is Taihape.
Yeah taihape has even got a cool cafe now – in fact if driving that way stop there for sure – it is called brown sugar.> Hi there,
> David U, could you please explain a bit more about the CGT component, as I
> thought as an Aussie investor you consider the property like an overseas
> investment and that you are still responsible to pay CGT on Aussie terms…
yeah everyone needs advice from their accountant on that point, as everyone’s situation is different.
But you only pay CGT if you sell…why sell???good luck everyone!!
cheers-
Minisuburbs as in, of cities?
New Brighton in Christchurch, according to the Kiwi Property Investor magazine – can still purchase for around 200K and is poised to go up re: revamping of seaside suburb – I think it will become the ‘saint kilda’ of the South Island – give it a few years.KPI magazine (kiwi property investor) has all the stats, all the facts – like I keep saying here, subscribe to it, get it, if you are in NZ and living in Aus it’s a very good way to keep up with property matters over there. They have monthly data, articles, as well as lots of ads for (i.e.) people that set up structures, lenders, etc etc etc
cheers-
Minihi there,
i think it’s great, but also I agree with Neologism. I mean – if you analyse any mortgage over 25 years you’d be paying a horrific amount of interest. But the average lease-option-ee might not know that and get a shock.
cheers-
Miniquote:
I have been reading and hearing in the press that the property market will burst?Hi Marcell, funny that I found this thread directly after writing a huge post on another thread, about this exact same subject. The thing that really caught my eye was your quote above as it is my opinion (after hearing an expert say this at a seminar, which made perfect sense to me) that the media talks the market up and down – rather than what previously used to be the case which was that financial indicators like interest rates, inflation, and the economy drove things one way or the other.This expert said that these things change far less – inflation is capped, the government wants to keep interest rates low- etc – so if a bubble bursts it will be a media renzy rather than an actual one brought about by changes in the economy.
Also I don’t think that there are propery experts writing the articles -although people will take something they read in the paper as gospel truth as if it *was* written by an expert.
they are news-hounds trying to write a story that their editor will pick so that they get paid for their JOB.!! (unless maybe the editor changed the headline to include something about bubbles bursting so that anyone with a property will pick up the paper and have to have a read what the ‘experts’ are saying.)If there’s one thing that I learned from Kiyosaki it’s to only get your advice from other successful investors.
I would be interested to hear what Steve has to say on this subject???
cheers-
MiniI feel the same, – the seminars that Steve runs are in my opinion as good as or better than anything Kiyosaki or de Roos would run, (though different in style) and very much better value for money.
If you had unlimited money and you could go to every seminar I think there is benefit in every single one you go to- even if they are sharks selling rip-off schemes – there’s benefit of going to one of those too, I’m sure.
Although Steve’s Property Masters is the only event I’ve been to ‘live’ (twice, because I enjoyed it so much the first time – plus I took my Dad the second time!! yay!) excluding some one-nighters with other people who don’t count for this comparison –
other seminars I have as recordings (dolf de roos, richmastery.) All of them teach about negotiating, the numbers, and other practical things to do with property investing.
There are also certain’ truisms’ that all seminars seem to cover – reasons to invest in property compared to other investments, conquering fears (so so so important!!!! )
– in fact,
the nitty gritty how to, why, who, what, where can be found in books as much as a seminar, (with the exception of wraps and lease options, which I think are so specific legally and so on that the only way to get this info is to do a course or buy a kit) –but what I found the MAIN benefit of going to a seminar was the call to action – the challenge to not be one of the majority of people who go to a seminar and don’t do anything.
that was the actual thing that made me get off my butt of one year of learning, reading, and thinking about it, and actually DOING it.If you go to a seminar and don’t use the information, then you just wasted your money!!
For me – no book would have been ‘enough info’ – attending a live seminar was *the* absolute key to me getting started.cheers-
Minihi richmond and aussierogue,
>Mini, as someone who works in a newsroom, you’re spot on >and it’s a continual source of frustration!
hehe, well if we ever meet up I’m sure we will have lots to discuss not only on property but on that subject too!!
Did you read the interview with Dan Rather in Rolling stone not long after Sept 11, the issue with Shirley Manson on the cover I think? He touched on some chilling things…..rogue,
>although im loathed to reply to this topic. mini the references >you are using ie richmastery, property seminars, api >magazine – they sound a little unbalanced as far as reference >material goes.
huh???
API unbalanced? In which way? I remember when they did the numbers on a positive cashflow property versus a negatively geared on in a suburb of high capital growth in order to try to see which one was better long term. (cashflow came out better, but not by much. Mind you, it was a measly 10.something return in the example…)
Richmastery – haven’t got through the whole seminar yet so don’t know that yet- the guy who was saying the media talks the market up and down was someone called Jason Whitton who is a property developer in Sydney, knows the market very well –>but i
>im guessing you also have a vested interest…..
OK we’re not talking about the issue ‘does the media control the market’ now, we’re talking about the ‘do I think the bubble is not going to burst?’
to which the answer is, yes, I probably don’t think it’s going to burst in any major way, unless from a media-induced mass hysteria selling frenzy….a vested interest – Not necessarily – I don’t have a cent invested in the Aussie property market for a start…can’t afford it yet!!! hehe
secondly I have been buying for cashflow in NZ towns that don’t even have bubbles yet – (and theoretically, if the capital value of the houses I own went down, but the rent remained the same, I wouldn’t care – because I’m intending to hold long-term -)> that the market >goes up or you wouldnt be so positive.
I am investing in property because over the long term property goes up. Is that a reason to invest? Yes. if that makes me ‘so positive’….then Okay.
now as far as bubbles bursting – IF i had just flicked an expensive negatively geared property, believing that negative or flat growth was just around the corner, then I would WANT there to be a burst bubble, because it would vindicate my action…..
(is that the negative side to my ‘positive’?)
However………you hear people all the time here regretting that they sold their (sydney area) properties and they would be worth XYZ now. So….my actual opinion is that the Sydney bubble will never burst, as long as the predictions that the city will continue to grow….and grow….and grow…..are true.
Demand is ever increasing….so will prices…>i think if we were on a forum board for shares there would >be similar one sided views
d’you mean, like people that had bought XYZ shares arguing that they would continue to go up – because they wanted them to?
>my 3 cents
it’s gone up to 3.075 now, in line with inflation….no really, in relation to the bubble, as I am not in the ‘maybe bubbly’ market, i consider myself an impartial observer- but as a person who lives in sydney, loves it, and has no intention of moving – what I *really* think is bubble schmubble….
cheers-
MiniPS
please reply cause I’m really interested to hear what you thinkchandara – same, same!!!
And if i didn’t say hi properly before I meant to, I really enjoy your posts, the one about all your properties was really interesting. Is chandara a man or woman’s name? Trivial question I know. just interested
cheers-
MiniPS and of course a shout out to the other ‘locals’
hi there,
>does this translate that it is the rich and powerful that are >influencing the property market prices for their own gain ?
I don’t think so – it makes sense to me that the ‘market’ is driven by owner occupiers as they are the market – not ‘investors’-
>or are they merely trying to create attention to their own >stories about property to sell more.
to sell more newspapers – not properties!
I’ve read/heard that wealthy people store their wealth in property long-term (rather than trading it up or down like people use the stockmarket)>If not, then of what interest does the media have in talking up >or down the market ? other than selling news papers, >magazines or TV news items etc… ?
if there’s one thing that september 11 and the iraq brought home it’s that the so-called ‘news’ is nothing more than a press-release sent out by whoever’s releasing it – OK let’s not go there – the property dudes richmastery reckon they do it to sell papers- create sensational headlines, get people hooked in to buy papers to read about it, follow up with more stories, sell more papers…etc
cheers-
MiniI think it’s the media!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
not an original idea, but one which when I heard, made perfet sense…Don’t forget, only 6 percent of the market are INVESTORS.
That means that 94 percent of the market is driven by Owner-occupiers.
!!!! Anyone would think it’s the stockmarket around here, the way people talk about booms or busts. I just don’t think things happen that quickly or radically with property.
OK so most of the market – the 94 percent owner/occupiers- They choose carefully, choose on emotion/ their budget, and then tend to stay there for a while. The stopped looking at ‘what the market is doing’ (if they ever did) because they’ve moved into their new home, and that is pretty much that for the next while.
It’s these people that are looking to the newspapers and TV for their ‘truths’ about the market – they don’t do the numbers themselves. Wouldn’t necessarily be buying API magazine and going to seminars..(Remember again that the PPOR by nature is always going to be negatively geared, too – – even if it would have been +ve as a rental.)
I watched a richmastery video where they explained this (that the media drives booms!!) a lot better than I’m doing it.
They said that previously, booms/busts were to do with real market-driving fluctuating factors such as interest rates, inflation, but nowadays interest rates are much more stable- inflation has been capped, … so the media talks it up and then talks it down.6 months ago compared to now, the indicators are exactly the same or maybe even more favourable to buying, but the media is saying ‘PROPERTY BUBBLE ABOUT TO BURST???’ which gets the fear into people, who start to panic, and talk about it – etc etc
my three cents
cheers-
Mini
