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  • Profile photo of kay henrykay henry
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    Shushar,

    What I think is reasonable is that the person who is receiving hte money explains what will happen to the money if the purchase does not continue- *before* money is sent.

    If I was DD, I’d be sending that money back to the person who sent it- as a gesture of goodwill if nothing else. Then the sender might choose to give it to charity- whatever.. it’s Chan’s money, and he wasn’t told he was going to lose it.

    I still question the legality of that transaction. If people want to keep other people’s money, they should be upfront about what the process will be.

    kay henry

    Profile photo of kay henrykay henry
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    I am saying I wouldn’t sign a contract until I had done inspections. I wouldn’t sign a contract until I was sure I was going to buy the property. I can;t be bothered doing and undoing paperwork. When I know I want something, I get it. Or I miss out- it’s just the way I operate. Usually, i develop a relatoinship with the RE anyway, and they’re happy to be a little patient because they know I’m on the level.

    kay henry

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    Well AD, I think 22 properties is plenty! It’s more than I’ll ever have- you’ve done so well :) Are they all buy and hold AD?

    kay henry

    Profile photo of kay henrykay henry
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    markpatric :)

    As for me, I’d just prefer to have inspections etc done before a contract is signed. I wasn’t referring to a deposit- i was discussing a contract. I guess I just feel that a contract is binding (in my mind- not legally) so I wouldn’t enter into it unless certain. I have also asked a RE about their attitude to gazumping. I think if a RE and vendor know a person is sincere, and wishes to buy, it wouldn’t be good for them either to mess around someone when it’s so close to a finalised sale.

    kay henry

    Profile photo of kay henrykay henry
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    Thanks Risky :o)

    My IP’d never get near CF+ anyhoo- I just take what I can get if i find a good place :) I always think “investment” meaning one has to sew to reap.

    Risky, are purchasers satisfied with a low deposit from you? I always figure if someone puts in 10% they’re more unlikely to get cold feet and to move ahead with their commitments. If oyu decided to pull out of a purchase of say 200k and you only had $200 deposited, I would get your $200. But if someone deposited 10% and pulled out, i would get 10K of theirs.

    Do you think that might get regulated? I guess people will put in really low deposits if they want a cheap “exit” clause. I think i’d always make a purchaser give me 10%. If a person pulls out on a sale just before settlement… that’s 6 weeks off the market- time for the place to go stale and be harder to sell.

    kay henry

    Profile photo of kay henrykay henry
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    Jarmbie, I think it’s quite usual for there to be offer and acceptance but no contract signed. Often, inspections are done before a contract is signed now, and sometimes, because this time is given to the purchaser *before* signing a contract, the solicitor will ask you to waive the cooling off period once signed. So take your time and do what you have to beforehand. Also, you would never have to agree to a waiving of a cooling off period. In QLD, I don’t think they even have a cooling off period!

    Jarmbie, being a hard negotiator is not everything. It depends on whether you want the house or not. $5000 off for discoloured tap water? You’re hoping for another 5k off after BIR? Depends on what you want to do. But if a vendor feels messed around by a purchaser, they might pull out too- that’s sometimes hte price of getting these reports- they come back unsatisfactory, and purchasers have to pull out of the deal. I know people who have lost a fortune on the price of the inspection reports- particularly when the sydney market was so heated.

    It sounds like it could be a cat and mouse game with you and the vendor. If V wants to sell to you and you want to buy from V, then I am sure you both can negotiate it out. V wants to give you no discount, and you want a 5K discount… can you both live with a 2.5K discount? Build a relationship with the V. Then it’s easier to negotiate. But remember, noone wants to be told their place is a dump… so go gently :))

    kay henry

    Profile photo of kay henrykay henry
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    A truthful awakening, of course, Bear!

    kay henry

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    Well, young people need to rent too, Apples, and we were young once too- remember? :o)

    Apples- for 80k in a town with a uni and shopping centres etc, it might be a decent deal.

    hmmm- now lemme think… if it is wagga you’re thinking of, I have some local knowledge of the area. There are some streets you might not want to buy in. If it ain’t wagga, that’s cool :o)

    And any party that doesn’t have the police called is probably not worth attending. hehe.

    kay henry

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    Mini- wow, you’ve hit the nail on the head!

    For me, it’s:

    ‘Steve didn’t pick me for the MAP, so I hate them all’

    ‘What makes them think that they’re better than us?’

    ‘I don’t think it’s possible, because i haven’t managed to do it. So I want them to fail, to validate my own failure’

    ‘I haven’t been able to find a CF+ve property, and it’s Steve’s fault.’

    ‘the only way that can succeed is by trickery, because everyone successful is dishonest.’

    Mini- before you mentioned these things, I didn’t know what I was feeling :o) But now you’ve named it, I can get therapy and heal!! hehe ;)

    And is there a book coming out? Yay. I haven’t had my life changed in a while- it’ll be timely :)

    kay henry

    Profile photo of kay henrykay henry
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    Risky said:

    “if you work on Steves 11 sec rule it would have to be rented at $144.00 pw working on a 10% deposit at 6% however your repayments would be around the $115.00 pw p&i or $90.00pw interest only loan .”

    Risky, I am gonna take a risk myself here and question your rental income needed to make it CF+. Basically, I just look at he purchase price and double it for around a 10% return. So at 80k price, that would be $160 rental. I do *not* think about taking into account the deposit when calculating this figure- i reckon that’s cheating :o) (Or else it’s COCR, not CF+).

    Then you would have to add in all the other charges- BC fees, rates/water, vacancies @ 2 weeks, landlord protection insurance, PM fees etc… surely this is what’s taken into account to come up with a CF+ rental yield?

    Can people please correct me if I’m wrong, but this is where i got the “upwards of $160” figure. It is probably about 170 after you take all the above into account.

    kay henry

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    Yeah Apples…

    Ask them the size of the unit, if it has an internal laundry, if it is a flood-prone area, the age of the block, how long the unit has been on the market, the size of the town (you might need more than a 10% deposit if it is a town under 10,000 people), if the unit has a parking space, if the unit has floorboards under the carpet (this is likely for units until about 1985), what inclusions come with the unit (perhaps it has heating etc), has it been in any way refurbished, tenancy history, body corporate fees, rates and water fees… and then ask the RE all about the town, industry etc and look up on the net anything you can find about the town.

    But given that you have used the term “cash flow positive” it seems you already have some idea of real estate- what gives, Apples?

    kay henry

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    yeah, they’re probably charging too much for rent. Some people need a big reality check. People who want to charge $350 for a 1-bed place in the cities might realise that most of the people who can afford that rent can probably also afford to buy their own PPOR.

    Student markets in cities are the potential, but those kind of rents only apply to International students, and not some of the ones I deal with on a daily basis- students from bangladesh etc- sad thing is, they come over here with promises from the Universities, and end up living in overcrowded slums miles from nowhere.

    And I agree- buying a PPOR at the top of the market in the cities is making a huge commitment- for 25 years!!!

    kay henry

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    Apples…

    Depends on where the unit is. For that price, I’d say regional or country town.

    To make it CF+, you’d probably be looking at upwards of $160 rent, but if the market rent is $95 for the unit, that’s what you’ll be getting :o)) Ask the RE’s in the area what the rental market is, or look it up on the internet.

    If the place is opposite a major shopping centre, it should be ok to rent. Tenants might not like the traffic, but in my opinion, people don’t mind being opposite a busy part of town.

    kay henry

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    MarkyMark said:

    “I’m not trying to rain on the parade and I don’t think that I am being negative.”

    Your perspectives are welcome here, MM- don’t apologise for them- I personally don’t think you’re being negative :o) Others might, but really you’re entitled to your (well thought out, in this case) ideas. I also doubt if many people on here would disagree with your analysis.

    Yes, there has been CG in pretty much every area of australia, so whilst the rural properties are now *comparitively* cheap, compared with, for example, wages, they are not something you’d just throw your money into without thinking.

    Rural is one thing, regional is another. But if you can have a long-term tenant and there is a rental market in the rural town, then why not?

    Choices are becoming less and less in Australia of buying cheaper properties.

    Good luck in getting those 15-20% returns! What’s that again? 100k property rented out for $400?? Um, I don’t think so :o)

    kay henry

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    Richmond,

    This is- we’re always being told to buy more and more property… because one just can;t have the dream by owning 1 or 2 IP’s… so whilst a contingency plan (or exit plan) is one thing, most of us will probably want to keep buying regularly to build a portfolio. I remember a while ago, my ex said to me she wanted to buy 1 property per year, and at the time, I thought she was being delusional, but now I see people doing that all over the place- and not coming from a background of large capital to do so.

    So, maybe I’m changing :o)) But i guess I realise more is possible than I thought before- despite rising interest rates, one just still has to increase the portfolio- just hope it doesn;t do my head in with stress :)

    Richmond, you and I are of about the same vintage. One gets a sense of “workplace morbidity” after a while, I think, meaning that work lives don’t last forever.

    I might have to be like some of your mates and get in over my head! But I am probably different to your mates- my thing is cheaper properties, so my risk is lower.

    kay henry

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    yack, you said:

    “Actually if there are any dropout, I would love to know why! What were there experiences?”

    I doubt you’ll hear from those ones. I tend to think most of these programs are fairly well stage-managed, and that there’s probably secrecy/non-disclosure clauses the MAP participants had to sign in relation to the program. I do love democracy :o)

    I wonder if there were any MAPpers who were opposed to any of the strategies to become millionaire-controllers! I wonder if they thought that wrapping wasn’t win/win, did they then become a lose/loser in the program.

    Welcome back AD- i hear you’re a very nice guy :)

    kay henry

    Profile photo of kay henrykay henry
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    Now if I were Steve, I would have offloaded dome of my spare properties onto the MAP people. It would be very “win/win”. The MAP people would get to control the properties, and Steve would get the money.

    But as you all know, I’m not Steve ;) But think about it- it’s quite a strategy. You get a captive audience in the MAP people, all looking up to Steve and hanging on his every word. If Steve sold them his properties, it would be like having his own extensive buyers list right on hand! win-win is so cool!

    kay henry

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    richmond, re interest rates… my mortgage went up by about $50 a week when IR’s went up by 1%- that’s quite a hike in repayments, I reckon. That extra money comes out of my wage. To me, it doesn’t matter what rates were historically, it’s 2004, and I live in the present. No doubt in the Depression or in some cultures if high inflation, rates have been 30% or something, but still… in 2004, IR’s wouldn;t want to get too much higher, or my disposable income will be so much less, and my goose will be cooked!

    Yeah, those melbourne prices are exxy at the top end for sure. I wonder if vendors are still “holding out” and setting their sale prices at the same level as before.

    I reckon the older established eastern suburbs market will always maintain its value. The Melbourne establishment is not gonna let it all fall to pieces :)

    kay henry

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    Elves, I have no intuition- guess I’m not much of a woman :o) I kind of prefer logic and reason :)

    Mel- soooo pleased you are guru’ed out!! You’re such a strong person, you can make it on your own!

    kay henry

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