Forum Replies Created
Thanks Terryw,
When you say the chidren would be beneficiaries you assume I must be employing them to work inside the business. Your right typically this would be ideal as myself and or my wife would also be the employers of our children. There would be no other employers for them.
The company could own the “business” where the children live while myself and my wife reside in separate houses owned separately by both of us. We then go to work inside the business but in separate departments and then live together inside the “business” before finally each going home to our separate houses. So my wife would have her own home and have her own bills and life separate from me. I would have the same as we don’t actually co-habitate.Jins13 wrote:I think good agents are worth their weight in gold. Besides, with your theory that you should look after all your affairs would mean that if you invested in other states or distance areas, you would have to personally go there for the inspection and etc.If you will read my theory in more detail as in the posts above you will understand this not to be the case. The primary relationship of the tenant employs the tenant and deducts the rent from the tenants salary before it is paid every fortnight. Also the primary relationship does the inspections on the tenant for you, the homeowner.
Remember the role of the primary relationship is to be somebody the tenant is to maintain the respect of in order to maintain its
position in the world. So the tenant will be required to gain and maintain this respect by keeping things tidy and in order for the primary relationship.
Additionally the primary relationship has the power to reduce the income of the tenant if it seems to be misbehaving as it is also
the employer on the tenant.For example- If you have a IP in the states and the tenant in your house works at Wallmart. The primary relationship would be a
represantive from Walmart who is actually the boss of this person bound by law not to disclose information about this person to
others in order to maintain the privacy of the tenant. Next you will make arrangments which would include a contract with Wallmart
that your tenants work income of $35,000 would be subtracted an amount of $15,000 for the rent which would go directly to you and bypass the tenant. So the tenant would be paid a salary of $20,000 only and not have to pay any rent from this. I am not sure
how taxation would be calculated into all this but it is the basic idea and the end result is a requirement for you the homeowner not
to have to manage a relationship with any agents or tenants yourself. The whole IP is simply numbers on a peice of paper no different to having money in the bank and also the tenant is more able to manage its own cashflow as it knows that it does not have to manage to budget to pay the rent but rather only budget for other bills.As a result you are able to rent properties to people without having to manage relationships with Agents or Tenants fullstop and once people are employed by their primary relationships there is NOTHING stopping you guys from doing the same thing in Australia.
xdrew wrote:Your values laid out here step back to a period of a village mentality.
A tenant wants the ability to rent .. the ability to pickup and vacate if and when he chooses. The landlord wants the ability to have his property let out to anyone who stakes up the right amount of money per month to justify his letting.
They dont want to know each other. They dont need to know each other. Outside of the provision by the landlord and the occupation by the tenant .. there is no other need for a further extension of that relationship.
In TFS they don’t know each other. From the spouses (Also the tenant) point of view he/she is to maintain the respect of his/her primary relationship in order to maintain its position in the world. The primary relationship is actually doing a job on behalf of the government who gives the rental income back to the actual property owner in the form of an automatic deduction from the spouses income before it is paid every fortnight.
The actual property owner would never need to know or manage a relationship with any of the following people-
-The Tenant (spouse of the primary relationship)
-Any agents or other kind of property manager.
The person who owns the property actually does all its dealing with the primary relationship that does the inspections and payment management on behalf of the owner. So the property owner can access information including contact details about each of the primary relationships for each tenant in a government database (perhaps online) about each of the primary relationships for each of its tenants in each of his/her properties.
The primary relationship subtracts the rental income from the spouses income before it is paid in order to help it manage its cash flow better. It can do this as the primary relationship of every person is also the employer of every person and actually pays the spouse its salary.
In TFS, this type of social structure is exactly what is meant by Integrating your family and Business into a single entity. The system reduces the number of people you have to manage relationships with, significantly making life easier. So instead of having a set of relationships for work, a relationship for your rental house and personal relationships to manage, you only have one for work and accomodation. This is your primary relationship. Additionally if you get married then you have a personal relationship but this one will actually end up being interdependant and actually exist inside a third entity were married partners actually work side by side in the workpalce while living in separate territories.I believe at this point I have explained myself and my alternate theory of how we could manage relationships associated with our investment properties better.
Mosqui wrote:This is crazy, you mean that people should not have investment properties, do you? Then this forum is not really for you. I think this thread is confusing for everyone because Istvan has not explained the concept clearly from the beginingThat’s a great observation. This says to me that you understand what im saying. At-least to a degree. My theory does not imply that I believe we should not be able to own investment properties. But rather not own them and be responsible for forming relationships with people in order to manage them in the way that we do.
For example I could own a property which is managed by people I have nothing to do with and if they dont pay me rent on time, then I may simply be able to sue them. They would not need to know anyone who knows anyone who knows me or anything like that. The tenant would never need to know who may sue them for not paying the rent, only that if they don’t pay their rent then someone will. Even if I took them to court, they would never need to know my full name or address as it doesn’t matter.
This way there are no relationships associated with the investment property in which I own and derive rent from and there is no need to manage relationships with extra people just because I own a property someone lives in. The property is just numbers on a piece of paper with no relationships attached just like having money in the bank.The Tenant who lives in my house has a primary relationship who needs to be respected by the tenant in order for the tenant to maintain its position in the world. The role of each persons primary relationship would be to report information about their spouses to the government who holds information about everyone in a confidential manner. It doesn’t matter who owns what property were, only that those who do so get paid the right returns on their investment. This way, If I own a investment property in Sydney and I want to move in, rather than contacting the agent to ask the tenants to leave, I would contact the NSW government who would make contact with the primary relationship of the tenant in that house who would make arrangements for the person to go elsewhere. The person who I rang at the gov office may also be a primary relationship to someone unknown elsewhere. Or may also be a spouse to one. Also there may be multiple primary relationships inside a family structure of a number of generations.
My primary relationship may also have a primary relationship with the oldest member of the family structure reporting information about everyone back to the government.Remember, in TFS, every person is actually employed by their own primary relationship. Using myself as an example, my primary relationship would make the arrangement to deduct the required rent for the house I reside in (in NSW) from my income before I am paid each fortnight. This way I am actually paid only the remainder of my income every fortnight which already has had the rent taken out. This would go directly to the NSW government and paid back to the actual home owner of my house every fortnight as income. Your cash flow is much easier to manage like this when you dont have to think about managing to pay rent from your income, but rather know your rent is already paid and you will be paid what’s leftover. I could own 200 properties across Australia and the primary relationship of the person paying the rent for each would deduct this from the salary from each person before they are paid every fortnight. Using this alternative method it is no longer nessasary for me to form relationships with an agent and/ or a number of agents who manages my 200 properties. All the deductions are done automatically as the primary relationship of each person has already taken the required amount for rent from each persons salary before they are paid. So as long as each person continues to maintain their relationship with their primary relationship (also employer), then the rent will continue to hit the homeowners bank account (me) every fortnight in this way. If a single fortnights worth of rent was not present one pay period I should simply contact the NSW gov and give the details of the house who may contact the primary relationship of the tenant who may report the problem back. This is the role of the primary relationship. They frequently do things like this on behalf of their spouses.
In summary, I don’t think we should not be able to own multiple properties by any means. I believe we should be able to buy properties and know we will never have to be involved in the relationships needed to derive rent from them full stop. This includes agents. I believe my reasoning for this to be explained above including the details of how investment property owners would get paid in the previous paragraph.
Catalyst, if you read this post then you will see I have just also comprehensively explained your previous reply about owning lots of properties and not having enough family to fill them.
xdrew wrote:Istvan051 wrote:Hi Catalyst
I understand your point of view how if you own property in the current world its always going to be much better to use agents to handle the tenants and the problems they may face. They are better at doing this as they are professionals and have a lot of experience and are trained to handle people.
Based on your reply you obviously didnt quite get a full understanding of what im trying to say. What im trying to say is that I disagree with the simple fact that we are allowed to own properties in which to derive rent in which another person or family lives which is not part of our own. This is not to say I dont beleive in capitalism or anything like that. I think capitalism is the most ideal system and I believe strongly in each persons right to own and accumilate wealth in the form of $$$ however they please.
But, by allowing people to own property another person or family which is not part of your own family lives in, we are creating a need to manage extra unnessasary relationships in our life with people who are not really part of the group of people we relate to regardlessly.
I beleive the person who you identify as your primary relationship in you life should also be your landlord. This may be one of the following- A parent, sibling, aunt, uncle,cousin, ect.
I beleive this person should also be your work manager so when you go to work this is the person who tells you what to do.
By doing it like this we are reducing the number of people we need to manage relationships with significantly and making life
a hell of a lot easier.Regardles of if your primary relationship is actually your landlord or not, you will have to maintain a relationship with this person
and if it happens to not be your landlord then you will have additional people to maintain relationships with. Additionally if you own property then you will be required to maintain a relationship with a person who hopefully is good at being a professional and managing tenants and their problems. If not then you have to manage an additional relationship with a tenant and good luck to you!I beleive humans naturally form hirearchies based respect. The objective of every person is to maintain the respect of their primary relationship in order to maintain its position in the world. So as you grow up and reach independance and interdependance from
your parents and particularly your primary relationship. Rather than moving into a house owned by a third party, every person should move into a property own by their primary relationship and at the same time actually be employed by this person in business. Then the primary relationship should have the option of actually deducting your rent directly from your salary before you
are paid so you will be be better able to manage your cashflow.I dont need to go into extensive detail about how wrong this is. Socially .. financially and morally. Whatever you do .. dont write a book explaining about relationships.
Human relationships exist on two levels .. co-operative .. and dominant. Usually when they are co-operative they are actually seeking common goals .. no matter how simple they are. The sheer idea that just because its a more personal relationship than a landlord its going to be any better is lunacy and actually dangerous. DO YOU REALISE HOW MANY FAILED RELATIONSHIPS THERE ARE ?The agent i employ as a property manager acts as a go-between. He's the 3rd person I refer to as the manager of my property .. the collector of the rents and the condition reporter of what goes on with my property. He's vital in all 3 aspects. I dont want to be there managing my property all the time .. i want people who are there competant doing that for me. I dont want people I have to chase up for rent .. property manager steps in and does all the growling when necessary. I dont want to shuttle up to a property every time the tenants marriage is in crisis. Thats not my problem and nor should it be. Thats what a property manager is there for.
From the tenants perspective .. he's getting the use of a substantially more expensive property at a budget rate for his general usage as long as he doesnt abuse it. On most propertys thats 5% of the property value OR LESS. Thats using a 5 cent coin to purchase a dollars worth of goods !!!! Can you think of any aspect of life where thats possible? (actually for your real interest .. the normal level of rent to property value is historically 10%. So for now its HALF as cheap)
Rent is expensive? Rent is unnecessary? Good. Then you'll be ok moving out a couple of suburbs where the rent is more affordable .. the facilities are a little less .. and the convenience is not a good. WHAT? YOU DONT WANT TO DO THAT?
I as a landlord .. provide a service that the government is unwilling to provide at a reasonable rate .. simply because it would cost them money. And governments dont spend money on necessities .. easily. You currently get that at a budget rate .. so you can afford those large screen TVs and computers i see in your places when i go for 6 month inspections. What .. you didnt think i notice?
As a landlord i am held to the covenants and laws that bind me to a responsibility to keep the place in reasonable working order. The tenant should have rights to stay in the property .. and the right to not feel harassed or bled on the rental rate. He also should get regular maintainence. Outside of that .. he's got his world to live. And I have mine.
I'm tired of listening to the stereotype of the greedy landlord .. or the property manager who cant possibly be of any use. Its repeated in the media over and over again. I remain a landlord who has a significant responsibility to a large group of people who depend on me for the purposes of cheap and effective rental provision. Government wont provide that. The tenant either cant or wont provide that for himself. I make sure all that happens. And i'm tired of getting a stereotype that is innacurate rammed up my ass every time i would be seen to mention it.
I'll be reading your book. I'll be seeing what insights you can provide to improve what is a very workable situation. A very difficult relationship at the best of times .. but a workable situation.
If you are going to change the world, make sure the world needs changing.
Hi Xdrew,
First of all, thankyou for your detailed reply. I really value opinions as they help me tremendously with my own work.
I havent heard of the terms co-operative and dominant. I have studied relationships and I hope you understand the difference
betweeen the terms co-dependant, independant and interdependant. If not, please read about them a little online before you reply again.I do realise there are a lot of failed relationships in Australia and the world for that matter, hense my interest in relationships
and studying them in order to try and make a difference to this. If you get married in this country then there is a good chance you
will be divorced in around 10-15 years, its actually around the 50% mark. I beleive this to be mostly due to the tendancy for us to
form co-dependant relationships with one another but that is another story I can explain later if you are interested.I understand the role of your agent, like any agent he is the middle man who reports the condiiton of properties and manages the cashflow between you and the tenants. Thats what they do and some are better than others while some make you think you should just do it yourself. Those stories you see on ACA in my opinion are mostly due to people who when renting out propeties
to people are not smart how they conduct themselves. They often dont use an agent while having no real relationship to the people in their house who take them for a ride. These people know in most cases they will be able to get away with it for some time as the
rest of the world dosent really care.In my experience, people who live in a property owned by their family generally are not subject to the same level of rent increases
that the rest of society seems to be constantly bombarded with. A lot of the older generatioin who have one of their children living
in one of their investment properties or houses charge their child the same amount of rent regardless of what the rest of the world
is doing. I speak from experience. My father has paid and still does, $120 per week rent to my grandfather for the past 35 years, this is for a four bedroom house and it never changed. He could easily be getting 400-500pw on the same place with other tenants.
My grandfather never seemd interested in capitalising on his own son, to him it never seemd like the right thing to do. Once he was satisfied in his relationship he tended not to want to interfear by doing things like asking for more money, it just didnt seem right.On the other end of the scale sometimes if we know our tenant or even worse if we know them and they know were we live we can
get in a lot of trouble as they may well just take us for a ride. Thats if they are not part of our family group but are trying to become
close friends as they either dont want to pay rent or be subject to rent increases.Not all landlords are greedy but im guessing some may actually think they can bleed tenants of every penny, every rate increase oppurtunity arises. Some are quite honest im sure, you will get all types.
I am going to be honest with you in saying I really dont understand why you think my theory is unappropriate or socially wrong as you say and I also dont think you have had the chance to properly express your view as to why.
I still hold the view that integrating your business and your family into a single entity as in my book TFS is a more ideal way of conducting your life and business relationships.
I think you should go into detail as you say about how socially wrong integrating the family into the business actually is. I would be
happy to give you an honest reply.If you want me to to read any specific part of your reply and try to answer you then let me know. Alterntively just read over some of my previous posts or go into my post on integrating business and family into a single entity and reply there.
Cheers
Istvan051 wrote:Jins13 wrote:I think good agents are worth their weight in gold. Besides, with your theory that you should look after all your affairs would mean that if you invested in other states or distance areas, you would have to personally go there for the inspection and etc.This is exactly why I dont beleive in the right for us to own property in which people outside of our own family group reside. Your spouse could actually live interstate or even internationally in your property and these days with technology you would be able to form a on-going relationship with them for this purpose. In this case you would definetly have an interdependant relationship with them.
Agents are only nessasary as we have rights to own property in which people who are outside of our own family group reside. As a result they are the better option and are sought after to help us better manage and maintain our relationships.
In TFS, I am suggesting that we simply change the laws so the middle man (agent) is no longer nessasary as we have integrated the business and the family in together. The responsibility comes down to the spouse to maintain its relationship with the landlord (you), the primary relationship.
Additionally every person should be employed by this person so they actually work fulltime for their primary relationship and their primary relationship actually pays them a salary which has already had the rent taken out before they are paid in order to better help them manage their cashflow.
Also one more thing to add to this reply. This is that I also beleive the role of the primary relationship is to do the inspection. Hense the requirement for the spouse to maintain the respect of the primary relationship in order to maintain its position in the family. I believe we should be able to invest overseas like we do, but not in terms of properties anywere in the world as this implies a requirement to manage a relationship with a tenant weither it be done by an agent on our behalf or ourselves. I beleive strongly that all our relationships
should exist inside the family unit. Hense my reasoning for integrating the family and business into a single entity as in my book TFS. Additionally I also beleive that the primary relationship should also be your one and only employer.goldies wrote:I am very confused. You say that you should have your spouse living in your property even if it is in Alaska, because we should have a person with whom we have a primary relationship with in our properties?? and we can keep in touch by using computers??
Luke86 – I dont think you are not intelligent enough to understand. I think you are not confused enough to understand. I read this 12 times and I do not understand.
No, I am suggesting the laws be changed so we are unable to own property in the way that people who are not part of our own
family group are able to live in a property owned by you in order to make our relationships easier manage and to maintain. I think we should be able to own property like we can already but not houses in this sense as it implies a requirement to manage relationships with people who are not even part of our family groups. The people who live in the houses which we buy obviously have families themselves which they will need to maintain relationships with as well as your agent once you start renting to them.In this instance, you could have a property in Alaska if your spouse was living in it. Otherwise you would be unable to own a property in Alaska as the landlord of whoever lives in that property should be the primary relationship of that person. In this case
this person would likley be a relative of the person living in that property in Alaska and should also be the landlord and primary relationship of this person.I used that as a example to demonstate the simple fact that if you had a spouse living in your property overseas, then you would most definetely have a interdependant relationship as you live in separate countries and territories.
Interdependant relationships are easier to form and maintain in the new age with technology and computers which enable us to interact frequently even when we are miles away from each other.
If you dont understand any of my terms then ask me and I will explain to help you do so.
For example just to name a couple
The primary relationship, Spouse, ect.
Also to answer your actual question:
"You say that you should have your spouse living in your property even if it is in Alaska, because we should have a person with whom we have a primary relationship with in our properties??"
Remember as described above, the primary relationship should be the landlord. So if you are grown up enough to be a landlord then I beleive you should also be someones primary relationship. In which case if you have spouses who are adults and interdependant from you then they should live in a property owned by you. The objective of the spouse is to maintain your
respect in order to maintain its position in the world. So you dont have a primary relationship with your spouse, you are the primary relationship of your spouse. The spouse is just your spouse, nothing more.Offcourse ideally you would want your spouse living locally from you as you probably want to see each other regularly. Your spouse would still be able to be in an interdependant relationship with you even if it lived in a property owned by you across the road. But not if the spouse lived with you in your house. In which case your relationship would be either co-dependant or independant but not interdependant.
This is because in order to be in an interdependant relationship people need to actually live in their own separate territories with their own rules.
I have an invention. Its a food preparation system which people can utilise. It involves integrating a freezer and a fridge together and
including pullies, scales, timers and a computer to rotate every 24 hours worth of food for an indvidual. I have a menu crafted on the woolies website which includes all the ingredients for three months worth of food prepared into disposible containers which every three months I send to a private food catering service which prepares all of this according to a menu I have pre-prepared. They then deliver all this to my front door and I stack it away in my freezer.
The next phase of my invention is to create the integrated fridge and freezer as specified above. I currently transfer manually every 24 hours worth of food from my 500L chest freezer into my refrigerator, every night. I want the next phase to eradicate this requirement.
Can anyone suggest how I may go about finding someone to help me develop and promote my idea?
Catalyst wrote:Are you speaking hypothetically or do you actually self rent properties? I think the former. Correct me if I'm wrong.I am speking hypothetically but I am close to somebody who manages a number of properties. I have helped this person with its affairs
for years and I have experience in the game.According to my own theory I would call this person my own primary relationship but I am actually employed by another person outside of my own family which makes my relationship with my primary relationship harder to maintain. Ideally I should also be employed by my primary relationship and things would get much easier. Additionally this person should also be my landlord.
Jins13 wrote:I think good agents are worth their weight in gold. Besides, with your theory that you should look after all your affairs would mean that if you invested in other states or distance areas, you would have to personally go there for the inspection and etc.This is exactly why I dont beleive in the right for us to own property in which people outside of our own family group reside. Your spouse could actually live interstate or even internationally in your property and these days with technology you would be able to form a on-going relationship with them for this purpose. In this case you would definetly have an interdependant relationship with them.
Agents are only nessasary as we have rights to own property in which people who are outside of our own family group reside. As a result they are the better option and are sought after to help us better manage and maintain our relationships.
In TFS, I am suggesting that we simply change the laws so the middle man (agent) is no longer nessasary as we have integrated the business and the family in together. The responsibility comes down to the spouse to maintain its relationship with the landlord (you), the primary relationship.
Additionally every person should be employed by this person so they actually work fulltime for their primary relationship and their primary relationship actually pays them a salary which has already had the rent taken out before they are paid in order to better help them manage their cashflow.
Hi Luke,
I hold the opinion that you only disagree as you dont understand.
I quote "considering people need a roof over their head, then having a landlord is a necessary relationship".
What I am trying to say is that this person should be your primary relationship which you already have to maintain/manage a relationship with regardlessly.
I also agree with your last quote
"I don't get what you are trying to say with all of these interdependent relationship posts. But maybe I am just not intelligent enough to understand",
If you dont understand and actually want to understand then just read over my posts a few times and think about how it applys to your own life. I dont expect you to understand but please understand I have spent my life thinking about this in order to reach this
point. Everything in life is about relationships!It dosent mean your not intelligient enough but rather perhaps you are just not interested enough!
Remember in my book TFS we actually integrate the family and the business into a single entity. So your primary relationship is your work manager and your landlord as one person. You are actually employed by this person who actually deducts your rent
from your salary before you are paid in order to help you better manage your cashflow.Catalyst wrote:NO!! Tenants are NOT your family. They are the people who pay your expenses so your business can run. I have enough family and friends without trying to have relationships with strangers. Sure I have to have a relationship with the agent but it's a business relationship. They don't ring me with their personal problems (which tenants can sometimes do if you deal direct). eg My car broke down, I haven't got the rent etc). The agent weeds all this out.
Plus you don't "have to" employ an agent.Not to say it doesn't happen, but have you seen any of those stories on ACA about tenant problems that involve an agent? I haven't. There are people out there that have NEVER paid rent in their life. They go for the privately rented houses where they can go undetected. I'm not saying don't do it. There are advantages and disadvantages.
I privately rent 2 of mine. Agent was hopeless, tenants were good so I suggested direct debit to me. It's working out fine but I feel guilty putting the rent up. One is a single lady, the other a couple saving for their first home. I would not privately rent all of them (maybe if I was retired).
Plus when I recently went to refinance these 2 caused a little problem with the bank. They like agents to run them. And insurance. It's harder to get insurance if you self lease.Are you speaking hypothetically or do you actually self rent properties? I think the former. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Hi Catalyst
I understand your point of view how if you own property in the current world its always going to be much better to use agents to handle the tenants and the problems they may face. They are better at doing this as they are professionals and have a lot of experience and are trained to handle people.
Based on your reply you obviously didnt quite get a full understanding of what im trying to say. What im trying to say is that I disagree with the simple fact that we are allowed to own properties in which to derive rent in which another person or family lives which is not part of our own. This is not to say I dont beleive in capitalism or anything like that. I think capitalism is the most ideal system and I believe strongly in each persons right to own and accumilate wealth in the form of $$$ however they please.
But, by allowing people to own property another person or family which is not part of your own family lives in, we are creating a need to manage extra unnessasary relationships in our life with people who are not really part of the group of people we relate to regardlessly.
I beleive the person who you identify as your primary relationship in you life should also be your landlord. This may be one of the following- A parent, sibling, aunt, uncle,cousin, ect.
I beleive this person should also be your work manager so when you go to work this is the person who tells you what to do.
By doing it like this we are reducing the number of people we need to manage relationships with significantly and making life
a hell of a lot easier.Regardles of if your primary relationship is actually your landlord or not, you will have to maintain a relationship with this person
and if it happens to not be your landlord then you will have additional people to maintain relationships with. Additionally if you own property then you will be required to maintain a relationship with a person who hopefully is good at being a professional and managing tenants and their problems. If not then you have to manage an additional relationship with a tenant and good luck to you!I beleive humans naturally form hirearchies based respect. The objective of every person is to maintain the respect of their primary relationship in order to maintain its position in the world. So as you grow up and reach independance and interdependance from
your parents and particularly your primary relationship. Rather than moving into a house owned by a third party, every person should move into a property own by their primary relationship and at the same time actually be employed by this person in business. Then the primary relationship should have the option of actually deducting your rent directly from your salary before you
are paid so you will be be better able to manage your cashflow.How to operate your own life according to TFS
In order for you to operate your own life according to the principles of TFS you first will need to form your own primary relationship. Next your primary relationship will need to open a business and you will work under this person’s direction. The primary relationship should purchase an investment property and employ you at the same time. The investment property should become your residence. Next the primary relationship should deduct your rent/loan repayments from your salary so you are paid the remainder. The primary relationship should sign a contract which means he/she is bound by law not to release certain information about you such as your address to any person. If he/she did do so and you were harassed by any person you would actually be able to sue your primary relationship. Once you move in and go to work you have formed an interdependent relationship with this person. The primary relationship is also your employer and you will obviously be working somewhere inside the public sector away from your place of residence in order to maintain privacy. Your biggest objective in life is to maintain the respect of your primary relationship and do things under its direction in line with the type of organization your family structure is aligned with. Next if you want you may form an interdependent marriage to some person whom also has a primary relationship. This relationship will exist inside your work structures and you will have the option of working side by side to this person in the public sector. At this point your entire social life exists inside a third dimension, the public sector. If you have children then in order to maintain interdependence with your married partner you will need to build facilities inside the public sector which the child/ren will reside in. This is necessary in order to maintain interdependence with your married partner. Without these facilities you will end up going back to co-dependence as you move in together in order to share the care of child/ren. This is where most people in the modern world lose out as when they have children they without even knowing it end up going back to co-dependence, and they start having problems as they find a constant need to compromise with each other. By maintaining interdependence after children you are greatly improving your chances of a long term, vibrant, productive and healthy relationship for years to come.
The following is a firm from Brisbane who actually specilizes in doing what im talking about.
Next a short video on family businesses
http://www.businessfamilies.org/en/virtual-library/celebrating-business-families
"Try getting into a meaningful relationship & telling your partner that you will continue to work with them but not live with them, have children with them but not share in the parental responsibilities, care or nurture them, not socialise with your partner or have anything to do with their care or financial situation".
To start with at interdepedancy remember couples live together inside the publc sector. In other words, we actually share the care of our children together in a third entity. Next we share parental responsibilities inside the public sector. We socialize everyday day, together, inside the public sector. We nuture our children inside the public sector. We live and build our interdependant relationship inside the public sector.
The primary relationship of each person holds information about each person but is bound by law not to disclose this information to other people in order to maintain privacy. So if I decided I felt dishonoured about something you (my wife) did or said and decided I didnt want to talk to our children and also stoped talking to you (again, my wife), then the role of the relevant primary relationships is actually to communte and then work towards a resolution for their spouses. This is the job of the primary relationship.
The primary relationship actually forms naturally inside the public sector. So it may end up being mum, dad, a sibling, granparent ect. Once it is formed the person is actually employed to perform this role for the spouse. To take the spouse from co-dependancy to interdependancy which in TFS, is the definition of adulthood. Once the child reaches interdependancy they are able to take on the role of being a primary relationship to someone else themselves.
Remember in TFS the primary relationship is the one person you can tell absolutely anything to. The one person you have no secrets from. From birth to death the primary relationship is the foundation of your entire social structure and is actually recognised in the eyes of the law as the one person in your life of greatest importance (More important than even your married partner).
In TFS, I recognise this person to be just that and people would actually go through offical processes just like that of marriage in our current culture in order to gain a primary relationship. In turn, the primary relationship is employed by the government to perform this role for you for. The primary relationship should form naturally, be it a parent, sibling, aunt, uncle or granparent.
"How can a couple maintain a relationship & family if they don't communicate the basics & at all other levels? What's wrong with picking up a random shag instead of trying to create a cloak of deception"?
By integrating the business and the family into a single entity as in TFS, the ability of each person to communicate is actually enhanced. People are not forced to maintain the respect of alternate people outside the family as in the current world. Each person
actually works under the direction of their own primary relationship inside the business structure. As you grow up the role of the primary relationship is to take you from co-dependence to independence and finally to interdependence as you become an adult by definition of TFS.When you integrate the family and the business together what you are doing is actually streamlining communication between all
parties of the marriage and the key people in your life. This is done by reducing the number of people you need to form relationships with and communicate with on a daily basis. So rather than having a husband/wife and a work manager and perhaps a business partner and other colleges to interact
with on a daily basis. You have a primary relationship and then if your married your wife will be your secondary relationship and also you will be at this stage interdependent to both of these people. Your primary relationship tells you what to do at work and your wife works alongside to you at work from 9-5 for example. Your wife will also work under the direction of its own primary relationship. So in this context you may be able to see why in interdependency it is actually easier to maintain a relationship!The next step is the children which also exist inside the public sector as husband and wife share the care of their own children
inside the third entity. The primary relationship of the child will form with time and then the role of one of the parents/sibling is to take this role and take the child thorough to interdependence. The child will also work under the direction of its newly formed primary relationship inside the next generation of business structure.
The second part of your question I really don't fully understand what you mean by picking up a random shag instead of trying to create a cloak of deception.
I am only guessing what you may mean by picking a random shag may refer to the current world were people have multiple levels of relationships to maintain on a daily basis. People live with their co-dependent, get up in the morning, go to work and do what their managers, work partners tell them to do. They then go home and interact with the wife who perhaps did the same thing somewhere else at another work. Next they have to
interact with each other with the daily gossip and news in order to keep their own relationship functioning. Next if they have children they have to make choices about how to raise them together whilst simultaneously managing relationships with work
managers and other business partners. Additionally they will often have parents and other relatives to deal with who will often
talk behind each others back behind you and form bias opinions about you. This all requires work to manage on each of their behalfs.
In TFS we integrate the business into the family so there is one main business culprit to manage and we call this the primary relationship. The primary relationship is under a binding agreement by the government not to release information about us such as our address so we go to the world, the world doesn't go to us. In other words, we run our own life!
Next we have the interdependent marriage which exists at a third entity and is easier to manage then a wife
who lives with you co-dependently at home. We classify all these people and then integrate them into the business so that
we all have a common goal which is that of the agenda of our family structure. i.e. Anything from a supermarket to a public service office.
Scott
I got some spare time now so here goes.
"A few points that you may have overlooked, if they are married/in a defacto relationship, then each has claims on the other's assets, why would they consider living separate lives & continue to work together if they were a couple?"
The thing to understand with interdependant relationships by the definition of TFS is that people are not actually living separate lives as such. They live together inside a third entity called the public sector.
This is the part which takes most people a little bit of time to get their heads around but once you think it through it makes sense. As a result husband and wife actually have separate financial entities as such. What interdependance does is that
it takes the simple truth of each position of the marriage and weaves them together in a third entity called public sector.
The simple truth is as such that husband and wife will have differing ideas about how money should be spent and or saved.
The result is the simple need to constantly compromise with one another. By taking the relationship along with each persons
sense of identity to a third entity as in interdependance, husband and wife have their own territories separate from one another
and actually have an enhanced sense of choice and freedom. This is not to say they are living separate lives by any means. It simply implies that they actually live inside the third entity for the larger part of their time.
In TFS hudband and wife actually spend more time together than in the typical modern world were husband and wife actually
work at separate places and only see each other at night. In TFS husband and wife actually spend all day, every day as well as perhaps night together while living in separate territories. Each business is integrated to include the family inside so husband and wife actually have the option of working side by side (as business partners).What interdependance simply does is that it puts people in a situation were they are not sheltered by the other partner by means
of providing a financial "Doll house" so to speak. By creating separate territories and financial entities for one another and then living in the middle the typical need to compromise is abolished. They now live in the public sector which is a world which is
actually governed by a third party. i.e. the state so to speak. They have their own territories which contain their own individual
choices about how they like to do things and prioritize how they would like to spend their own money.Also to answer another part of your question right here, yes they do have private places inside the public sector were they can shag.
Hi Scott,
I will give you a decent reply in a couple of days
I think apartments have a few issues which subtract me from considering them. i.e. the lack of privacy with other people is a real turn of. Sharing common walls means you may very well hear people in their own lives next door. On the other hand, less maintance in terms of the block. These days you can get artificial grass and simple plants to reduce work on your block. With a bit of $$ and work a house on a moderate size block can offer enough privacy with bascially the same on-going mainteance requirements.
Your right, in AUS and other developed countires people are chosing to have less children due to a shift in culture and values.
Some people choose not to have any children at all simply because they dont want the expense and stress. Our population is still
increasing rapidly and we do need to reduce population growth before we run out of space for future generations.Role of marriage in Interdependent relationships
In interdependent relationships the role of marriage not only includes legal formalities between people who agree to enter into such an arrangement, but also for the integration for proper accommodation setups which need to be facilitated. For example in the interdependent marriage neither party needs know where the other person privately resides as they will actually live together inside the public sector. But they still most probably intend on eventually having children which if so will also reside at the public sector. Also the relevant primary relationships of each person will need to be introduced in order for them to be able to communicate if either party of the marriage has problems with the other. For example if the wife has a problem with the husband’s contribution to the responsibility of the child she may first try talking to him directly and if he doesn’t seem to be listening she may communicate to her primary relationship whose job it is to communicate to the primary relationship of the husband who will talk to the husband himself. The husband’s primary relationship has the power to actually reduce his income if he seems to be misbehaving. This diplomatic process may be utilized for either party of the marriage.
“Interdependence is a dynamic of being mutually and physically responsible to, and sharing a common set of principles with, others. This concept differs distinctly from "dependence," which implies that each member of a relationship cannot function or survive apart from one another. In an interdependent relationship, all participants are emotionally, economically, ecologically and/or morally self-reliant while at the same time responsible to each other. An interdependent relationship can be defined as an entity that depends on two or more cooperative autonomous participants (eg – co-op).”
