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  • Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    @derek
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    I understand the person who owned the property was working overseas in Africa – the same continent the scam originated in. Probably just a coincidence.

    I also understand both properties (one sold + one almost) were mortgage free.

    But – scammers are getting trickier and trickier.

    Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    They would probably prefer to make payments in line with their own pay cycle – will make things easier for their own budgetting. Worth the question tough.

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    Hi Mal,

    Onslow is an interesting one.

    I expect getting funds for a lend in Onslow will be extremely hard – I expect lenders will consider it to be highly risky. We are hearing the Onslow LNG companies are looking at Karratha, over Onslow, as a place to house their construction workforce.

    Insurance premiums will be high in Onslow – cyclone alley it is.

    Very small town too – which increases risk exposure to investors.

    Mick – I would be wary of trying to jump in before a mine is established. That is a really a high risk strategy – Ravensthorpe and Hopetoun would be classic example where that strategy has failed. There is a lot of work required to bring a mine up to production levels so you could be waiting a few years.

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    Today's Property Observer has an article on NRAS Property here

    Thought it may be a useful read for some people.

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    You'll probably find the contract you have signed is pretty well water tight and if there are any out clauses they'll be few and far between. The builders/developers of these projects and their solicitors are well versed in these sorts of contracts.

    Get your broker to review your situation in light of your changed circumstances and see if you are in a position to get finance.

    If  the answer is no then seek independent legal advice from someone who is well versed in off the plan contracts.

    I assume your original solicitor was recommended by the vendor – if this is the case it is extremely important you seek independent legal advice.

    Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    Chris2012 wrote:
    We had the property revalued and extended to loan ready for our next purchase.

    Could I pay the council rates of the IP, which is a tax deductible expense, from these borrowed funds?

    Hi Chris,

    Taking a bigger picture look at your proposal.

    Tax deductibility with the caveats mentioned above will generally be fine.

    But take a peak at what you are proposing.

    You originally set up the LOC facility to fund additional purchases or, in other words, to build and create additional wealth. Now you are looking at spending some of that LOC to carry some existing property expenses. In effect you are eroding your wealth using equity this way. If you continue to use your LOC in this manner, and your home does not increase in value your LVR is increasing and your net wealth position has deteriorated.

    Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    Has already happened once in WA.

    The owner of the property sold out from under him almost lost another to exactly the same scam. Only got caught out when a neighbour happened to mention the property sale to the owner.

    Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    I expect a BA will meet with you to find out what you want, how much you can afford and which areas you want to buy in.

    When they find a few properties that meet your requirements they'll present you with all of the details and work from there.

    I am not sure about BA fees – suggest you do a google search and see what comes up.

    If you find a property you like you can deal directly wit the listed selling agent. There is no need to use a BA if you have the confidence and knowledge to find your own property.

    If you do find your own property and still want to use a buyers agent make sure they can value for money as you have done most of the hard work and found your own property. There may be some BA out there who will negotiate on price if you find the property.

    Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    hannahbella3 wrote:
      she told me that it was just a glitch in the system and the tenant is only $120 behind,

    'only' $120 behind. Sounds like your PM doesn't recognise the importance of doing their job properly. Tenants generally should be in advance. Sounds like your tenant may be $120+ 2 weeks rent behind.

    hannahbella3 wrote:
    so i said not a problem just monitor the tenant to see if she falls behind any further and just put the money owed in next months statement.

    Should have been more assertive at this point. Sends a clear message to your PM that you have service standards you expect upheld. At this point I would have requested supplementary payment to see if your were being told the truth at this early stage.

    hannahbella3 wrote:
      so then the next months statement came and still no money so i rang the agent and asked whats happening and she said i dont know whats happened but the computer was wrong and she is actually 8 weeks behind in her rent.

    Once again sounds like an incompetent agent. I find computers are rarely wrong – it is more often data entry or failure to follow processes.

    hannahbella3 wrote:
    my property manager is liable because they didnt send out the breech notice and to contact reba which i will do taday. by the time we get it taken to court the tenant will owe 12 weeks rent which will be $3840. my question is has anybody been through a similar situation?

    In addition to REBA I would also send a strongly worded email to the PM and their principal seeking immediate restitution of lost income. I would also get another agent on the job – rent rolls are important to agencies. Changing agents is one way of sending a strong message to this one. If they try and hold you to any exit clauses assert yourself on the basis of failure to perform required duties of PM.

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    PLC wrote:
    The former, Derek.

    Though as Jamie has mentioned, if you have been pre-approved once and your situation hasn't changed, there really isn't a need to renew/extend though people do want it for their own peace of mind.

    The big question is how reliable the pre-approval is in the first place. There is a thread on this forum in the last week or so which went over that.

    Regardless of the pre-approval, I always suggest that any non-auction purchase have a subject to finance approval clause added in the contract.

    Cheers

    Tom

    Thanks for that Tom – certainly cleared that issue up.

    Agree that a well written subject to finance clause should be included in all non-auction purchases.

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    kat13 wrote:
    I get the general idea that this is what some people do, however I cam across someone today who says not to do this ever.  Is this really a problem, has anyone got any stories/advise on the pros and cons of this?

    Be interested to know this 'someone's' investing experience and knowledge.

    I assume their solution was to save cash for a deposit – is this correct?

    Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    Hi Tom,

    Is the 90 day extension fairly widespread or confined to a limited number of banks?

    Cheers

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    njohns17 wrote:
    Hi this is my first post so hopefully makes some sense and is appropriate!

    Welcome aboard. Your question is entirely appropriate and you'll probably get a few responses over time. Some of the responses may vary a little – the challenge you may have is to work out what suits you & your situation.

    njohns17 wrote:
    We are in the process of searching for first investment property and our broker has aided us in getting pre-approval, an equity loan and restructured our PPOR mortgage.  It all is looking good so far.  The pre-approval expires on Dec 5 but I don't want to rush into a purchase without being fully informed.

    While Dec 5 seems a long way off – in property terms, it isn't. My understanding of an end dated pre-approval such as the one you have is that a finance application should be submitted before expiry date. One of the resident brokers will clarify this.

    If this is correct you may want to do some 'homework' to get a wriggle on.

    Having said that – an expiring 'pre-approval' is not the end of the world and it is better to make a good decision, rather than a hasty one. As an aside interest rates have recently reduced so your borrowing situation may have improved in light of recent rate movements. That is, if the remainder of your situation largely remains as previous.  

    njohns17 wrote:
    The sticking point is the more reading I do the more questions I have and am getting a bit lost.

     

    Keep it simple at this stage – work out what your broad plans are, kids in the picture? work changes? lifestyle changes? job security? your ages? your timelines? your current financial position? etc. All of these factors should be considered as they will help you determine your strategy and, from that, what sort of property you should be seeking. 

    Once you have the big pieces in place the rest becomes a little easier.

    njohns17 wrote:
    My question is that as we have $250,000 of our PPOR to pay off should we be looking at negative gearing with the tax benefits used to pay lumps sums off the mortgage to reduce quickly, or can the PPOR be reduced in a positive cashflow situation? 

    If you do negative gear then you do not have to wait for the end of year tax return. It is possible to complete a PAYG tax variation to estimate your tax position at the end of the year. It can result in you tax being reduced every pay period rather than waiting for the lump sum when your tax return is processed. The PAYG doesn't equally apply to small business owners and is most suited to wage and salary earners.

    The issue you have with negative gearing per se is that you largely spend a dollar to get part of it back. The portion you get back varies according to your taxable income.

    On the other hand positive cashflow will give you additional income (less some tax) that could be directed towards your mortgage.

    The tricky part is that in some case depreciation can help make a property which on the surface appear to have a negative cash flow into one which is positive after tax benefits are applied.

    Which ever way you go you may need to consider ownership structures and make up to maximise any tax benefits that are available to you. If the property you choose is negatively geared then the higher income earner should own a greater proportion – if the property is positive cash flow then the lower income earner should own more.

    And then there are trusts etc

    njohns17 wrote:
    I have read the negative gearing position becomes limiting over time and it is not really my intended plan to travel that way, but do i need to negative gear initially until the PPOR is paid off?

    See above – as rental income increases or your taxable income reduces then the impact of negative gearing also reduces as you fall through the various tax boundaries.

    I would argue you don't NEED to negative gear. Sure it is an option but you don't have to. Would really need much more information to provide a more detailed response.

    njohns17 wrote:
    Our broker is not able to answer this as it incorporates tax and not their specialty and I am still trying to find a tax accountant in canberra with property investment expertise.

    I can understand this – some experts simply don't want to go over to a field in which they have no qualifications. Litigation and licensing put an end to that a long time ago. I might add the tax, finance and legal world is a constantly shifting position and unless you specialise in an area – keeping up can be hard work.

    Hope this helps.

    Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    @derek
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    It will depends upon the long term objectives of the people concerned.

    Given they have no other debt – paying down the LOC has some attractiveness to me. Offset account would be better.

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    dgirl wrote:
    They were considering simply renting the family home but after conversations are now considering buying one or more investment properties.  They are still unsure what to do with the family home, now that the home is paid off, and it is not tax deductible.

    Tax deductibility should never be the primary reason for investing. They can do both, continue to own their own home and buy additional investment properties.

    dgirl wrote:
    They are considering selling the PPOR (for around 500,000) paying $50,000 cash for a deposit on a $500,000 IP and keeping the rest of the money in an offset account. If this reduces the interest to almost zero, is there any point as there is nothing to negative gear against… would they be better buying a couple of properties?

    This is a pointless exercise – in fact they go backwards due to buying and selling costs and the lost of CGT free status for 6 years on their existing property.

    Their net wealth position does not change. They still own an asset worth $500K and their tax position (exc CGT above) largely remains the same.

    dgirl wrote:
    Second, is keeping the family home a viable option?  I've noticed a few posts reference releasing equity and taking out more than one loan — one for the deposit and one for the balance.  Does this mean 100% of the IP is financed?  As I understand it, they would not be able to access all the equity, only around 80%, so would have to look at properties around 400,000.

    This certainly is a viable option as they avoid loss of $ for buying and selling costs. Sure their taxable income increases and may expose them to increased income tax. But even on the highest marginal rate they will still retain approximately 50c in every dollar earned. Check the tax scales to see how it may play out for your friends.

    Note different countries have different tax treaties and arrangements so make sure your friends seek specific tax advice about any of their plans from someone suitably qualified.

    It is possible to have 'two loans' and to technically borrow over 100% (in total for a property) I'll show you what I mean.

    Let's assume they buy a property for $500K. They will need an additional $25K to pay for purchasing costs.

    They can use line of credit funds of $125K to pay for their deposit and costs. This loan facility can be secured by their existing home.

    The balance remaining $400K can be a separate loan facility and is secured by the investment property. In addition this second loan does not need to be with the same bank as the line of credit. 

    In this scenario the interest on both loans is fully deductible as the funds have been used to purchase the investment property.

    I am not a broker so someone will come along and clarify/confirm this for you.

    dgirl wrote:

    So with this in mind, which strategy is better:

    1.  sell the PPOR & pay cash for the deposit on 500K IP with 450K loan 450K in offset

    2.  sell the PPOR & pay cash for the deposits on two IPs (and borrow more funds)

    3.  release the equity, and buy a 400K property 

    Option 3 wins for me.

    Hope this helps.

    Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    Hi Dgirl,

    LOCs are a great tool if used correctly and with discipline. I have seen people squander their LOC – this is certainly something to be avoided at all costs. The greatest tainting of LOCs occurs with people mixing non-deductible debt (car, holiday etc) up with their investment debt.

    I like to keep things simple – I use an offset account linked to my own home to assist with the home loan and have a LOC for my investment properties.

    MY LOCs and IP loans are all interest only. I do not use a revolving line of credit facility as per those companies who advertise "pay your home loan off in 10 years with our secret" – as I said in my previous paragragh I like to keep things simple.

    You can create multiple LOCs secured by one PPOR.

    Hope this helps.

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    See you have been thinking about things already.

    It is possible to use a strategy of buying alternating properties (one for cashflow and the next for growth or vice versa).

    The reality is that is over-simplifying matters as your situation may demand an extra cash flow (or growth property) property at some stage along your journey.  What you buy next is best determined by a broker because they will understand you capacity to borrow additional money. As a borrower of money you will require income (cash flow) and security (growth) – a good broker will be able to have conversations with you explaining that your serviceability or security level is getting a little tight and you can act accordingly.

    The key to successful property investing is borrowing money and that is why a good broker is advantageous.

    But back to the other part of your question about 'getting both in one property' – that is entirely possible and there are a number of investors who follow that line of thinking. They seek property which can be sub-divided, renovated or developed. These strategies add value and increase rent return – which is something difficult to achieve with new properties, including NRAS options.

    Hope this helps.

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    Hi Wheeler,

    Is your unit along Herdsman Parade or somewhere else in Glendalough?

    I understand the Herdsman Pde units have shown little growth over the long term apart from tracking the wider market

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    Hi TT,

    My understanding is that you will not be able to claim the interest on the redraw of $110K if the $110K is used to pay down your home loan.

    If, however, you were to use that redraw funds to buy other investment properties then interest on the $110K redrawn would be deductible.

    Please note I am not an accountant – someone who is will be along shortly to provide a definitive answer.

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